Shut 'er down!!

Excuse me but that is not name calling ignorance and arrogance are a condition! ie ignorance of the facts, arrogance is holding youself to a level few of us could rise too! Like Harry Reid's arrogance towards the tea party! I think you need to get a dictionary out and do a little reading, while your at it you might also try the constitution.
your reply with regard to calling a "spade a spade" is in politically correct terms racist, that term harkens from a long time ago and was in reference to the black community.
 
Steelhead1 said:
your reply with regard to calling a "spade a spade" is in politically correct terms racist, that term harkens from a long time ago and was in reference to the black community.
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No it ain't:

The phrase was introduced to English in 1542 in Nicolas Udall's translation of Erasmus, Apophthegmes, that is to saie, prompte saiynges. First gathered by Erasmus: Philippus aunswered, that the Macedonians wer feloes of no fyne witte in their termes but altogether grosse, clubbyshe, and rusticall, as they whiche had not the witte to calle a spade by any other name then a spade.
 
John,
Yes correct but here in the U.S.based on some places people were raised in particualr the south, back in the early 60's the term was used to identify black people. Wasn't right then and isn't right now!
 
Shut er down

The law is poorly written in haste , It exempts certain people from the system, It also another MANDATE
by the federal government without funding. It needs to go.
The supreme courts decision was wrong. Roberts put his own twist on reading the bill and proclaimed it a tax, thus allowing it on those grounds
What makes anyone think that the judges are so wise, a bad decision is a bad decision. This one was on Liberal partisan politics.
 
I don't care who calls who anything you can even call me a dago or wop! I know what I am. I just don't want Wilbur to shut use done, this is getting good. Can't we all agree this is about controllling people and your health. Also good one Hovis!

Joe salt
 
adamsgt said:
I hope you are aware that the Affordable Care Act was written by the senate democrats behind closed doors and did not allow any Republican senators to have any input whatsoever to the bill.
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I wish folks would take the time to go back through the development of this ACA instead of listening to the yackky mouths of the US media. They would find out that the ACA was in large part written by the Heritage Foundation!!!

Here is part of that story;

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...re-insurance-mandate-has-long-checkered-past/
 
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Steelhead1 said:
John,
Yes correct but here in the U.S.based on some places people were raised in particualr the south, back in the early 60's the term was used to identify black people. Wasn't right then and isn't right now!
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First "ignorant" and "arrogant." Now "racist." Makes "extremist" look pretty harmless.

I'm not a southerner and never heard "calling a spade a spade" used in a racist context. You can use it in that context but I'll abstain.
 
Let us focus, please

Steelhead1 said:
I think you need to get a dictionary out and do a little reading, while your at it you might also try the constitution.
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You can always tell when a guy is losing a debate--he switches to an unrelated tangent.

The issue here is the Tea Party's strategy of holding the federal budget hostage while they are fighting a losing battle to kill the ACA. It has nothing to do with dictionary definitions or the U.S. Constitution. For the 3rd (and last) time: instead of using the procedures of the Congress to try to repeal the ACA, the Tea Party minority thought it could kill an existing law (passed by Congress, signed by the President and upheld by the SCOTUS) by refusing to pass a CR to keep the government running unless it included provisions to defund or delay the ACA. The Tea Party will lose this battle but doesn't care how much damage it does or how many people are harmed by it's narrow, extreme agenda.
 
Well we would not have to keep having continuing resolutions if the POTUS would submit a budget and the Senate and congress approved it. The president hasn't submitted a budget that's workable in 4 years! The last 2 he submitted to the Senate were so bad he didn't get a single vote in the Senate! They voted 99-0 against his budget, and they voted the same the year before. Let me reiterate that means that every single democratic Senator voted against his budget. So the democrats are as much at fault as the President for not doing their jobs for the last 4 years! This hole argument would be moot if a reasonable budget were in place.
 
Letting this go for the moment but knock off the personal stuff please

I'll add to the discussion by saying that if the elections ain't rigged then we're in a hell of a mess for sure.
 
I fully believe the elections in 2012 was rigged. How can any one district, anywhere in this country, have 110% of the votes counted all be for Obama? How can there be 110% of registered voters?

The other tragedy, was all those that chose not to vote and stayed home. You all can thank yourself for what we have now.
 
I do want to say this again....

The current ACA bill was NOT passed by the Congress...only the House passed it, the senate did not vote on the current version or even bring it to the floor....WHY....because they didn't have the votes to pass it. Thus, they used a bypass provision in the constitution. Was it legal, yes but to say the Congress passed it is incorrect.

Hovis
 
Shut er down

Both parts lie. If its such a great deal why hasen't congress signed on to it?
That said Bonier and Reed have a deal to exclude congress from it.
Both parties are guilty, the statis quo rules.
Lets make a deal is their game. time for a change.
 
So the tax dollars are still being sucked from our wallets by the IRS as the glorious government is shutting down operations.......then where is our tax dollars going if the government is shutting down??? No more different then a business ceasing operations - no more income required. Again, why are our tax dollars still being collected if the government is shutting down??? A question for all of us to ponder.....

Matt
 
Article 1, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution contains the requirements for a bill to become law. It MUST be voted on and passed by BOTH houses of Congress. There is no provision to bypass this. The Senate did vote on the ACA. If there were such a provision then the Republicans wouldn't have had to vote over 40 times to repeal it. (Which, according to the GAO cost over 60 million dollars).
 
Over half the states was against it and sued to stop it, I don't know if that ever happened before (except maybe for prohibition and of course the civil war), I think that sure means something. The states are the law except when it comes to interstate commerce from what I studied.
 
Senate vote on the aca

AndyTaber said:
Article 1, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution contains the requirements for a bill to become law. It MUST be voted on and passed by BOTH houses of Congress. There is no provision to bypass this. The Senate did vote on the ACA. If there were such a provision then the Republicans wouldn't have had to vote over 40 times to repeal it. (Which, according to the GAO cost over 60 million dollars).
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Of course it was voted on by the Senate--it passed 60-39 and passed in the House 219-212.

The claim that it never passed the Senate is yet another example of trying to deny that it's the law of the land, some illegitimate scheme cooked up by "socialists."

How can we have a rational debate if one side distorts or denies the facts?
 
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vicvanb said:
Of course it was voted on by the Senate--it passed 60-39 and passed in the House 219-212.

The claim that it never passed the Senate is yet another example of trying to deny that it's the law of the land, not some illegitimate scheme cooked up by "socialists."

How can we have a rational debate if one side distorts or denies the facts?
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Did you hear and see the president claim on MSNBC this morning that he has bent over backwards to accommodate the republicans the last few years. That's it. The guy just flat out lies. How can you have a debate or discussion with someone like that? Remember when he Told Paul Ryan " I don't have to give you anything, I won the election".

Also, I agree that Obamacare is the law. So, where does the president get off changing it unilaterally without any action from congress?
 
The President hasn't "unilaterally" changed anything. The 1000 or so exemptions being used by the politicians do not exclude them from the act, they merely allow small, self insured, businesses to use a lower annual cap for services until the annual cap is eliminated in 2014. They do not want to cause financial problems for small businesses. They are not permanently exempt from the law.

Also, congress and their workers are not exempt from this law. They have been given a 1 year longer period of time till they are moved from the Congressional Group Plan, into the health care exchanges. The exchanges were not prepared to handle this large group all at once.
 
HovisKM said:
As far as I'm concerned, leave the goverment shutdown, at least the numb nut in the white house can't tax me anymore than he already has. As it stands now...the all mighty one who is all for the middle class (that's where I fall) cost me 250.00 more per month in taxes this year, doubled my electric bill in the last two years (through the EPA) and if he gets his way with health care, will increase my cost by 230.00 per month and that is not including what I will have to pay in taxes for those who get the credits. Yeah...he really likes the middle class.

Hovis
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Hovis makes a great point, one the media and many Americans seem to want to ignore. This administration has played the ever so tired left angle of "the middle class and below are being oppressed by the rich". To that end much of the rationale behind ObummerCare was to help the average American. Yet the middle class saw a sizeable tax increase in January of this year. I have no doubt this'll be the first of many (I'm middle class and I was hit even harder than Hovis' $230/month). My insurance, which is company provided, will be going up; meaning my paycheck will go down for no upgrade in service. Millions, and I reiterate, millions of Americans will endure the same. And/or companies will scale back employer provided. You can enter the exchange and at that point you'll likely pay more. On the energy front my utility bills have jumped considerably in the past 6 years. Obama isn't 100% at fault for that but his EPA stance has inflated cost. And what happened to the energy independence he spouted off about in 2008?

So how has this administration helped the middle class? The answer is they haven't. If anything they've hurt it. In spite of these quantifiable facts the left would rather stick their head in the sand and ride their "change, forward" mantra.

Anyways, America seems more interested in turning the shutdown into reality TV. Instead of focusing on the ACA itself, our growing debt position, the "out" year fiscal implications of the bill, etc, etc, we'd rather hang-on finger-pointing (much of which is media fueled).

Simply put, many Americans want to shift personal accountability to the government. We're becoming more detached, we vote on the spin game as opposed to substance, and we place image over track record. I got into it the other day with a guy that fully endorses ACA. When I asked if he's read it, he stumbled, looked at the ground, and said "no". Unlike many of the folks on Capital Hill I've at least read the condensed version (which is 2,000+ pages). My opinion isn't tied to some cable news slant but rather on the core legislation (and that opinion has a lot to do with debits and credits). I encourage others to do the same before they pick a side.

-Lee
www.singleactions.com
 
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