WBSF World Rimfire Championships

[Bill B]

Bill
Plenty of good gear outside the US these days, Craig sold the Duke, it's now in the UK. I have 2 new Turbo's one with 3 Gorham fitted ratchet barrels that Dan Killough tuned in his tunnel my other Turbo has Muller barrels fit by Eck and I'm just one of many outside the US who has tooled up for international matches.

You'll find shooters from around the world are keen to travel overseas as part of a national team, maybe it's just a case shooters in other countries have more passion to represent their country than US shooters do.

Peter

Peter, that sounds like US equipment to me - just on loan. The thing is that there are a bunch of us here that'll put that many barrels on in one season looking for that special one and will jump on any new action that shows any promise with a new build, even if we have a proven winner already in our battery. I'm pretty sure I tested your Eck build, it's a shooter - but then again - so are mine.

Brian, was Giovanni's barrel an Anschutz?

Any rifle with a US barrel, has dual citizenship.

 

[Bill Collaros]

There are probably many reasons why the US has not fielded a team. The US does not have one organization or federation for rimfire benchrest, we have 3 currently viable: IR50/50, ARA, PSL. Which one was going to coordinate and select the team? No one stepped up. We are also not as familiar with WBSF. We are more familiar with WRABF; how many world BR sanctioning bodies and world championships do we need? Isn't there another World Championship in Australia next year? International travel with all our stuff is a hassle. It's a long way to go, and a big expense. We don't need to go through all that to shoot against the best rimfire BR shooters in the world, as we can do that just about any weekend of our shooting season. I think the last WRABF World Championship in Charleston SC in '11 demonstrated that.

Hi Bill,

In answer to part of your question yes the WRABF 3rd World Championships are in Brisbane/Australia July/August 2015, there is a difference being a longer event with 4 different rifle classes, over 25 Countries and over 250 shooters, invites have just gone out for that this month and we will know around April the take up, i have had a replies from a few already wanting to take up their allocation of 9 per country and interest from at least 6 in the USA.

 

[Brian_K]

Brian, was Giovanni's barrel an Anschutz?

Bill, to be honest I don’t know, I’ll find out in May. If it is a US barrel I’ll be happy to give you 50% of the credit

(can't speak for Giovanni!!!)

Brian

 

[The Jet]

To be World Champions you first have to compete against the rest of the world.
I am sorry if I have insulted anyone as it was never my intention.
kind regards Ben

 

[Bill B]

I don't think anyone took offense. Whoever wins will be the World Champion, along with the 2011 WRABF World Champions of course.

 

[Peter Armstrong]

Bill
Who ever wins in France will be the 2014 world champion and whoever wins the teams match are the 2014 world champion country.

As they say, your only as good as your last match, so the rest of us (who have won) are just former world champions.

Peter

 

[Bill B]

But Peter, how about Greg Davis the Sporter and LV class world champion from 2011? Does he still get to retain his titles since there is no sporter or LV class at the WBSF world championship? How many sanctioning bodies do we need holding World Championships? Why do we need another international sanctoning body other than WRABF? Well the WRABF champions got to be reigning champions for 3 years. The WBSF champions will only reign for 1 year. How unfair!!!

 

[DonMatzeder]

The winner will only be champion for a day

But Peter, how about Greg Davis the Sporter and LV class world champion from 2011? Does he still get to retain his titles since there is no sporter or LV class at the WBSF world championship? How many sanctioning bodies do we need holding World Championships? Why do we need another international sanctoning body other than WRABF? Well the WRABF champions got to be reining champions for 3 years. The WBSF champions will only rein for 1 year. How unfair!!!

I'm holding a world championship shoot in my backyard the day after......I'll make up a set of rules in the near future to assure that no one has equipment that can qualify......

 

[Brian_K]

But Peter, how about Greg Davis the Sporter and LV class world champion from 2011? Does he still get to retain his titles since there is no sporter or LV class at the WBSF world championship? How many sanctioning bodies do we need holding World Championships? Why do we need another international sanctoning body other than WRABF? Well the WRABF champions got to be reining champions for 3 years. The WBSF champions will only rein for 1 year. How unfair!!!

It’s all about choice Bill, otherwise why isn’t everyone in the USA still not shooting BR50. Why do you need to bother with ARA, IR 50/50, RBA, IBS etc. etc. ?

The WRABF and the WBSF both have their models and while neither are perfect, it gives the shooter a choice (or do both!!).

Personally I like the WBSF model, one rifle, two competitions (individual & team), one clear winner in each event and done and dusted in four days (plus a practice day if you want it). I would like to see air rifle benchrest included (one class), but as a separate event, something hopefully the WBSF will consider.

I doubt the WBSF will be holding a WC’s every year, to the best of my knowledge that hasn’t been decided yet, but every four years would be more likely.

Brian

 

[Bill B]

Oh, certainly the world should not follow the US model. I wish there were only one rimfire benchrest sanctioning body in the US or maybe (imagine) in the world. It would make things easier and (possibly? - maybe not) less bickering. It would certainly be easier to see how we all stack up to each other. But that won't happen here - at least not for a while. I just think it's a mistake to have more than one International World Championship. It's like having 2 different and competing "Olympics" or having all those different boxing organizations (WBA, WBC,IBF WBO) with all their titles . That got so confusing that I don't know or care who are the WBA or WBC etc. heavyweight title holders. It can get watered down to the point of being meaningless and, at that point, why bother. JMO, for what it's worth.

 

[Bill B]

Hi Bill,

In answer to part of your question yes the WRABF 3rd World Championships are in Brisbane/Australia July/August 2015, there is a difference being a longer event with 4 different rifle classes, over 25 Countries and over 250 shooters, invites have just gone out for that this month and we will know around April the take up, i have had a replies from a few already wanting to take up their allocation of 9 per country and interest from at least 6 in the USA.

Bill,

Who in the US were sent invitations? Who's the US coordinator? Haven't heard anything about it here. With RBA dead in the water and with IR50/50 now being the US game that is the closest in format; is it Bill Hinegardner? It would be nice to hear from the US coordinator to learn about what's the selection criteria, so those shooters interested will know what they need to do to try to qualify.

 

[Bill Collaros]

Hi Bill,

All invitations go out to the designated delegate for that country, they are all clearly listed and links to their emails are on the wrabf site. Each country works out their own teams, in the case of the USA it is and has been for many years Craig Young, so if anyone is keen contact him.

The 6 i have mentioned have expressed an interest, numbers are due by April this year and names by Dec so there is plenty of time, if not this time there is the WRABF World Cup Slovenia in 2017 in conjunction with an ERABSF Euro Championship or the 2019 WRABF World Championships in South Africa so plenty of opportunities to plan and make teams etc.

I just answered your questions in my post, this is really not a thread about the WRABF, we do what we do and have clearly stated that and planned 6 years ahead, we have 25 countries on board and growing, what others do we have no control over.

 

[Brian_K]

Oh, certainly the world should not follow the US model. I wish there were only one rimfire benchrest sanctioning body in the US or maybe (imagine) in the world. It would make things easier and (possibly? - maybe not) less bickering. It would certainly be easier to see how we all stack up to each other. But that won't happen here - at least not for a while. I just think it's a mistake to have more than one International World Championship. It's like having 2 different and competing "Olympics" or having all those different boxing organizations (WBA, WBC,IBF WBO) with all their titles . That got so confusing that I don't know or care who are the WBA or WBC etc. heavyweight title holders. It can get watered down to the point of being meaningless and, at that point, why bother. JMO, for what it's worth.

Point taken Bill, I’m happy with two, never been fond of monopolies. I have some insight into FIFA (the world governing body for soccer) and from what I hear about the underhanded dealing of the Olympic committee, it’s a path we would be better steering clear of.

Let the WRABF and WBSF keep the other on their toes, hopefully we shooters should come out the winners.

Brian

 

[Bill Collaros]

2 totally different associations and offerings Brian and you know it, stop stirring the pot, the WBSF would be well advised to get their own spokeperson rather than others talking and ranting for them.

 

[Brian_K]

2 totally different associations and offerings Brian and you know it, stop stirring the pot, the WBSF would be well advised to get their own spokeperson rather than others talking and ranting for them.

In full agreement with you Bill, I’m pretty sure I pointed that out. As I said neither organisation are perfect. However I don’t consider making others aware of an upcoming competition “stirring the pot” or “ranting”. In fact, I thought that’s what these forums were for????

From the dealings I’ve had with the WBSF and the French Shooting Federation they have conducted themselves in a professional manner with the utmost integrity. A refreshing change and perhaps something you yourself might take note of.

Brian

 

[Bill Collaros]

Well let them talk then, instead of you and Peter giving the news and hearsay to everyone, I am tired of people on forums giving the impression they are in charge or the spokesperson for something when they are in charge of sweet FA.

 

[billyC]

I must also support Bill's comment. How many World Championships do we need? All of the World's top Rim Fire guys attended the WRABF championships last year in Plzen. The question that I have is should there not be one world governing body for Bench Rest Rim Fire. The existing WBSF rules where there is only one class and that is 14lb also does not make it really worth while to travel for. In my humble opinion WRABF should be the World controlling organization for Rim Fire. It is like allowing WRABF now to suddenly enter into the Centre Fire PPC space. I bet you WBSF would be up in arms if that happens. In my opinion WBSF should be there for Center Fire and center fire only. Could it be that there are internal forces that wanted to created a rival organization by entering into the Rim Fire space? I am just asking.

 

[Brian_K]

I must also support Bill's comment. How many World Championships do we need? All of the World's top Rim Fire guys attended the WRABF championships last year in Plzen. The question that I have is should there not be one world governing body for Bench Rest Rim Fire. The existing WBSF rules where there is only one class and that is 14lb also does not make it really worth while to travel for. In my humble opinion WRABF should be the World controlling organization for Rim Fire. It is like allowing WRABF now to suddenly enter into the Centre Fire PPC space. I bet you WBSF would be up in arms if that happens. In my opinion WBSF should be there for Center Fire and center fire only. Could it be that there are internal forces that wanted to created a rival organization by entering into the Rim Fire space? I am just asking.

Everyone’s entitled to there opinion Bill, your’s obviously lies with the WRABF. There’s at least nine of your fellow countrymen who seem happy enough to travel to France and I guess they are just the ones who were selected.

It’s all about choice, if the model of the WBSF doesn’t suit, then don’t attend, nobodies twisting anyone’s arm. As I said I like the WBSF model, one rifle means a lot less travelling cost (airfares) and the event is much shorter, saving on hotel fees etc.

Just for your information the WBSF has been around a lot longer than the WRABF and already has 31 member nations, admittedly based around centrefire but the rimfire has always been there, it’s only of recent years it’s woken up.

It’s the first WC’s for the WBSF, let’s see how it goes. It’s already a much larger event than the first WRABF WC’s held in 2008, with more to come I am sure. With the French Shooting Federation running it I’m confidend it will run like clockwork (they are also running the EBSF European Centrefire Championships the week before at the same range).

Brian

 

[billyC]

Brian the entire WBSF and WRABF has created rival organizations within South Africa where guys can only belong to one organization. I doubt very much is SA will fill up all 9 places. Unfortunatley most of the top ranked guys shoot under WRABF. The other challenge that we face is that almost all of our guys shoots both air rifle and rim fire. Therefore financially it is better to attend the WRABF competitions than traveling twice.

I have my reservations on how the local guys were selected, however it is an internal matter.
Unfortunatley the WBSF Rim Fire 'model' is not sustainable in South Africa. 99.9% of Rim Fire guys in SA is affiliated through our local Fedration who is affiliated to WRABF.

I wish the guys participating all the best

 

[Brian_K]

Brian the entire WBSF and WRABF has created rival organizations within South Africa where guys can only belong to one organization. I doubt very much is SA will fill up all 9 places. Unfortunatley most of the top ranked guys shoot under WRABF. The other challenge that we face is that almost all of our guys shoots both air rifle and rim fire. Therefore financially it is better to attend the WRABF competitions than traveling twice.

I have my reservations on how the local guys were selected, however it is an internal matter.
Unfortunatley the WBSF Rim Fire 'model' is not sustainable in South Africa. 99.9% of Rim Fire guys in SA is affiliated through our local Fedration who is affiliated to WRABF.

I wish the guys participating all the best

Hi Bill, I don’t know anything about the politics of member nations, in fact I go out of my way to avoid it. Somebody in SA has put down 9 places and paid the fees by the looks of it from the WBSF website, that’s all I can say.

In the UK we have no such problems and can shoot for either or both organisations without any difficulty, provided you qualify of course and are a member of the relevant internal organisations.

I know there are strong relations with the WRABF through Nick, and fair enough, how the WBSF in SA make their selections isn’t privy to me, in the UK it’s from the UKBR22 ranking list.

Air rifle is something I would like to see, but one step at a time.

Brian