Vern juenke machine

[Greg Walley]

For what it is worth…A long time BR shooter and HOF member cooperated with me on a project by making a batch of 100 bullets; 36 were defective, and we mixed them with 64 proven excellent bullets made on the same dies and lot of jackets. The gross defects were as follows (six bullets each):

1. Scratching the ID of J4 jackets with a blunt carbide scribe before seating the cores
2. Shaving the sides of cores with a knife, then core seat them into J4 jackets
3. Poor uniformity of lube on the jacket before the final swage
4. Seated cores with insufficient pressure
5. Seated cores with too large of a punch
6. Seated cores with too small of a punch

I sent these bullets to a third party to check on the Jeunke machine, and he was unable to distinguish the good from the bad.

If there are any bullet makers here with a Jeunke machine, I would like to see them try to duplicate my experiment. Maybe others will get different results.

I think the unit measures something. Another long time BR shooter and HOF member put me on to an interesting idea some time ago that one can use the Jeunke machine to identify bullets made on the same swage die with different lots of jackets. I’ve heard that one can calibrate the Jeunke machine to zero on one lot of jackets, and with the same zero – check a different lot of jackets and obtain a different reading (+/- of the original zero). Can anybody verify this?

Greg Walley
Kelbly’s Inc.

 

[Bart]

Jim

Gary O'Cock is one of the most highly respected and best Benchrest shooters of all time. Gary gave an excellent and on the mark comment to the question.

The post isn't about IF IT WORKS, but WHAT EXACTLY DOES IT MEASURE.

I've had 2 of the machines for over 20 years and found them to be of not much use for short range Benchrest.


Bart Sauter

Bart's Custom Bullets

 

[Bart]

Great post Greg!

 

[jim1K]

Greg, yes……..jim

 

[alinwa]

........I recently got into audio; it is my belief that audio cables for the most part are one of those products that are often referred to as snake oil.

Gary Ocock

LOL!!! You just hit one of my hotbuttons..... I'm not an "audiophile" by any means but my home theater puts the movie theaters in town to shame. My kids and their friends would rather watch a movie at my house than the latest cinemagic place. Portland/Vancouver metro, not hicksville USA. My floor moves and we make the calls at the Superbowl before the ref's do...... And I do like my music..... I have friends in the construction industry that do high end theater installs, I've brought my testing gear into $200,000.00 theaters setups to compare with mine. I've referenced both audio and video against "the good stuff" and in cabling alone I saved thousands of dollars.

Google this "audio cabling" scam to see coathangers beat out hunner'dollar "cables" for bet money!

Yes, "cables" are a scam.... nor will I pay over a dollar-two-ninety nine for HDMI or optical

 

[300ack]

OK this is an opinion from a long time 1000 yard shooter.

First off I only use a Jeunke machine on boattail bullets. I set the center of the boattail on the left ball on the Jeunke and run them this way. I think it tells how concentric the boattail is to the bullet body. In my opinion the boattail is the most important part of a longrange bullet. Think of it as the tail of an airplane,the tail does the steering. Checking bullets this way has eliminated flyers in my groups over the years. It will also show different lot numbers of bullets and different dies that they were made on. If you just run a match bullet flat on the Jeunke balls most all of them will run good. Maybe this is why shorter range shooters dont see any improvements with the Jeunke with flat base bullets. Also when bullets run on the boattail and show high deviaton numbers watch the tip of the bullets to see how out of round that bullet really is! For longrange shooting I think the Jeunke is an asset!

Just my 2 cents worth
Alvin

 

[Jefferson]

OK this is an opinion from a long time 1000 yard shooter.

First off I only use a Jeunke machine on boattail bullets. I set the center of the boattail on the left ball on the Jeunke and run them this way. I think it tells how concentric the boattail is to the bullet body. In my opinion the boattail is the most important part of a longrange bullet. Think of it as the tail of an airplane,the tail does the steering. Checking bullets this way has eliminated flyers in my groups over the years. It will also show different lot numbers of bullets and different dies that they were made on. If you just run a match bullet flat on the Jeunke balls most all of them will run good. Maybe this is why shorter range shooters dont see any improvements with the Jeunke with flat base bullets. Also when bullets run on the boattail and show high deviaton numbers watch the tip of the bullets to see how out of round that bullet really is! For longrange shooting I think the Jeunke is an asset!

Just my 2 cents worth
Alvin

good post

Jefferson

 

[Gary Ocock]

Gary, You think you should get a back and white measurement and why it works. What i said is the engineering department uses the same transducer but a larger scale. I do know some of the people that work there and the similarities of the Juenke to what they do. I do know about making short range bullets also, my friend makes or made a lot of record setting ones. I am no engineer and can't give the exact terms you seek to explain how it works,but it does. You could explain to me why a hummer barrel shoots through the wind,a top gunsmith and bullet maker i think would answer that, can't………. jim

Jim

I put in BOLD your request for explanation!

You forced my hand. I’m going let the cat out of the bag in regards to Hummer barrels and hummer bullets. All barrels shoot through the wind; some do it better than others.
Now how do we get one of those hummers? Well there is a secret society (no longer secret, as I’m letting the cat out of the bag) that meets on occasion to decide who gets those hummer barrels. This society, headed by several elite shooters and established criteria many years ago on admittance. Three steps for admittance. One, you have to spend a substantial amount of money within the BR discipline. Two, you have to embarrass yourself at least 89 times in match competition. Lastly, and this is the most difficult, you have to be able to figure a coded message within the placement of World Championship Pins on Tony Boyers hat. When Tony is wearing the pins there is a coded message, figure it out and your in. The leadership of this society is headed by Dr. Stephan Perry of the California Perry clan. This year after many days of Skyping the Society decide to send the 2 Hummer barrels available this year (from Hummer Barrel Inc.) to the first 2 shooters that order a Jimmy Johns sub and complain it wasn’t delivered fast enough. BTW those hummer barrels are mfg. by a consortium consisting of General Electric, Westinghouse and a small Co located just south of Wacco called Dead Nuts Tubes Are Us. The society also recommends that you practice shooting to achieve best results. It also doesn’t hurt if you have some Benchrest Shooting skills as well. Yea, I know, now you want to know, how to develop top flight Benchrest Shooting skills. Submit a notarized written request to Dr Perry and he’ll present it to the Society for approval. In lieu of the above buy a junkie machine and all your barrels will become Humpers or is it Hummers? Have a good one Ya'll

Gary

 

[alinwa]

well it aint a thou

 

[P. Octo]

My 0.01€ worth

This machine has been around a long time now.
For those who have one , what do you think it is measuring .
And why do you think this.
Because you were told , or you read some were .
Or has anyone ever had a electrical engineer look at it.
We do know it is measuring some thing.

I've had one for about 30 years and I've thought it measured the consistency, or uniformity, of the the mass of the bullets and the thickness uniformity of the cases. The deviations shown by the needle would indicate more or less resistance to the signal generated by the ICC (Internal Concentricity Comparator) which is the name I have on the instructions. I have never tested that by deliberately scratching some metal out but I aim to try on cases (Lapua .220 R).
When making a new batch of 20 cases I sort them with the ICC, just for the fun of it, before fireforming them for the 6PPC and, after 2 or 3 shootings, again before arranging them in the match box; the readings are definitely different now that the brass has been 'pummelled' and stretched by the gas pressure. I have no objective way to determine if this is indeed a factor but, as expressed in earlier posts, if it makes me feel good, what's the harm ?

 

[Ga. Dawg]

My Jimmy Johns sub...runnin late on delivery!

 

[JerrySharrett]

[/B]

Jim

I put in BOLD your request for explanation!

You forced my hand. I’m going let the cat out of the bag in regards to Hummer barrels and hummer bullets. All barrels shoot through the wind; some do it better than others.
Now how do we get one of those hummers? Well there is a secret society (no longer secret, as I’m letting the cat out of the bag) that meets on occasion to decide who gets those hummer barrels. This society, headed by several elite shooters and established criteria many years ago on admittance. Three steps for admittance. One, you have to spend a substantial amount of money within the BR discipline. Two, you have to embarrass yourself at least 89 times in match competition. Lastly, and this is the most difficult, you have to be able to figure a coded message within the placement of World Championship Pins on Tony Boyers hat. When Tony is wearing the pins there is a coded message, figure it out and your in. The leadership of this society is headed by Dr. Stephan Perry of the California Perry clan. This year after many days of Skyping the Society decide to send the 2 Hummer barrels available this year (from Hummer Barrel Inc.) to the first 2 shooters that order a Jimmy Johns sub and complain it wasn’t delivered fast enough. BTW those hummer barrels are mfg. by a consortium consisting of General Electric, Westinghouse and a small Co located just south of Wacco called Dead Nuts Tubes Are Us. The society also recommends that you practice shooting to achieve best results. It also doesn’t hurt if you have some Benchrest Shooting skills as well. Yea, I know, now you want to know, how to develop top flight Benchrest Shooting skills. Submit a notarized written request to Dr Perry and he’ll present it to the Society for approval. In lieu of the above buy a junkie machine and all your barrels will become Humpers or is it Hummers? Have a good one Ya'll

Gary

Gary, really?? This is the truth, you swear? And I thought all along Dr Stephen Perry was an EVANGULIST with a traveling revival tent and bus. I didn't know he was the High Priest of Barrel Humming!! That explains a lot!!

 

[Wayne Shaw]

I've done the embarrassing part a couple of times!

 

[dk hunt 14]

I had one really good 1000 yard shooter tell me when I had a bad flier that is was the brass that caused it. He told me he picks his brass out by the Juenke. I don't know where or how he set it up or what it did. Maybe a better thread would be to see how many of the longrange use one and how and for what they use it on. Matt

 

[Lee Martin]

Anyone have video of one of these in action? I think (underscore "think") I know how they're operated. Now as for exactly what they're measure.....???

-Lee
www.singleactions.com

 

[jfo1945]

Although I've never seen one, I would almost dare to bet the machine works by generating eddy currents into the sample and somehow measuring any differences in the eddy currents from different samples.

John

 

[Wilbur]

I had one really good 1000 yard shooter tell me when I had a bad flier that is was the brass that caused it. He told me he picks his brass out by the Juenke. I don't know where or how he set it up or what it did. Maybe a better thread would be to see how many of the longrange use one and how and for what they use it on. Matt

Did this fellow ever have a bad flier? I know I had one at the only 1000 yd match I shot...saw it hit the ground about 10 feet (at least) away. I don't know for sure but I think it was the wind that caused that one.

I think Lou's question is a good one as it is - what does this thing measure? He doesn't seem to care but would like to know given that it measures something. He just wants to know what it measures.....

 

[Lou Murdica]

vern 1 and 2 are same maker
vern 3 is a different maker.

http://youtu.be/_gCBp9Qd9yw
http://youtu.be/nUDqsqU-giQ
http://youtu.be/RE54ZfZ-rTM

hope this works

 

[Lou Murdica]

pictures of unit from bottom

 

[Lee Martin]

Appreciate the videos and pictures Lou. Interesting thread indeed.

-Lee
www.singleactions.com