tuning n133 in a big temp drop

R

rsmithsr

Well-known member
your local novice short range shooter has a match this weekend.
easy 90* today about the same fri,
sat maybe 70*
and sunday a real unknown maybe less.
i cannot add powder.
i have a full case at 29, shooting 28.9.
what do i take to the line on sat am ?
(20 off, 2005 n133m chuck miller 65 bt)
 
rsmithsr said:
your local novice short range shooter has a match this weekend.
easy 90* today about the same fri,
sat maybe 70*
and sunday a real unknown maybe less.
i cannot add powder.
i have a full case at 29, shooting 28.9.
what do i take to the line on sat am ?
(20 off, 2005 n133m chuck miller 65 bt)
Click to expand...

Your load is light(ish), and certainly you can add powder if it’s a PPC, guys are shooting well over 30 grains.
Do you use a drop tube?
 
no i do not have a funnel with drop tube tho bruno's aint far.
the rifle shoots well at this point. last match 2 of the 5 relays at 100, i had small group.


tim said:
Your load is light(ish), and certainly you can add powder if it’s a PPC, guys are shooting well over 30 grains.
Do you use a drop tube?
Click to expand...
 
i kind of like not shooting at the top. it shot well and brass life is good.
having said that, the question still remains, where do i go to when the temp drops ?

but i do listen...made this
 

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rsmithsr said:
your local novice short range shooter has a match this weekend.
easy 90* today about the same fri,
sat maybe 70*
and sunday a real unknown maybe less.
i cannot add powder.
i have a full case at 29, shooting 28.9.
what do i take to the line on sat am ?
(20 off, 2005 n133m chuck miller 65 bt)
Click to expand...

I use a tuner and 29.0 gr N133 is my default load. But I agree with Tim that at 28.9 gr N133, you have room to go up if you choose.

The book says there are about 120 fps and 1.2 grs of N133 between 1 node and the next. 20 degrees is not a huge temperature swing IMO. But if I were tuning by adjusting powder charge, I'd go to the line with your base load of 28.9 gr N133, a set of rounds at 29.2 grs, and a 3rd set at 29.5 grs. Test all 3 loads on your sighter target and shoot the record target with whichever is working best. Use that information to set up your loads for Match 2. Good luck!
 
Kyle Schultz said:
I use a tuner and 29.0 gr N133 is my default load. But I agree with Tim that at 28.9 gr N133, you have room to go up if you choose.

The book says there are about 120 fps and 1.2 grs of N133 between 1 node and the next. 20 degrees is not a huge temperature swing IMO. But if I were tuning by adjusting powder charge, I'd go to the line with your base load of 28.9 gr N133, a set of rounds at 29.2 grs, and a 3rd set at 29.5 grs. Test all 3 loads on your sighter target and shoot the record target with whichever is working best. Use that information to set up your loads for Match 2. Good luck!
Click to expand...

+1
 
Kyle Schultz said:
I use a tuner and 29.0 gr N133 is my default load. But I agree with Tim that at 28.9 gr N133, you have room to go up if you choose.

The book says there are about 120 fps and 1.2 grs of N133 between 1 node and the next. 20 degrees is not a huge temperature swing IMO. But if I were tuning by adjusting powder charge, I'd go to the line with your base load of 28.9 gr N133, a set of rounds at 29.2 grs, and a 3rd set at 29.5 grs. Test all 3 loads on your sighter target and shoot the record target with whichever is working best. Use that information to set up your loads for Match 2. Good luck!
Click to expand...

So you'd need to take a minimum of 24 rounds to the line? 3 for test and five for record of each load. That's 24 and a few more for foulers and sighters.
 
well the temp
we shoot in 100 plus alot.
90 was a cool day
70 is below normal
and sunday less 50-mid 60's
see how much testing/case filling i can do tomorrow
 
so with board guidance and that new fangled long neck funnel,
i shot 29.2,29.5,29.8 all shot well. 29.5 gave a very clear sine wave on the neck..so i will take it and my original load of 28.9 to line in the am.
i was able to get 30.6 in a case with room for a bullet.....dang magic funnel
noticeable recoil and some bolt lift. ne thinks the brass will not last as long.
 
so this was a match at ben avery in phoenix....the wind is not MY friend!
i just started short range br this year.
gusting wind from behind that moves left and right SUCKS.
I so not know if gary will post results, but lester did great, gary was great,
i finished 18 in 100, 200 and the ag....consistent!(26 shooters) lots of 4/1
 
You are probably not going to like this answer, but if you want 133 to shoot consistently at a very low humidity local like Phoenix, you are probably going to have to shoot in the upper load window. That means 30+ grins behind a typical 68/65 grn bullet.

I know several very good shooters who don’t even bother with 133 out there. And if they do, their load is somewhere in the 30.5 grn area.

Yes, the brass gets wrecked after an agg. That is why they have plenty on hand.

The last Nationals I was at at Phoenix, I shot and early lot of the old 2015 BR. About 29.2 grns. I hung in there.
 
I have tried something new, for me anyway on my last two set of cases that made it thru 20 plus sizings and still in good shape shooting in the 30 plus range with 2019 n133

I have a decent fitting full length bushing die but I started from the beginning using a Paul Bike ring die at every sizing. Primer pockets are still nice and snug zero click.
Just use it every time right from the start if your main die doesn’t squeeze enough. It takes a lot I believe my PB die is a 437. I’d have to check it

Prior to this method I’ve had primers fall out going to the line after 5 or 6 firings at that powder charge

If you can get a manageable system that allows you to work up there the guns just shoot much better especially at 200 and magically stay in tune better
 
To president with hope

Maybe there could a small stimuls by members to help keep thngs going due to so many cancelations every liottle bit helps
 
Tim Singleton said:
I have tried something new, for me anyway on my last two set of cases that made it thru 20 plus sizings and still in good shape shooting in the 30 plus range with 2019 n133

I have a decent fitting full length bushing die but I started from the beginning using a Paul Bike ring die at every sizing. Primer pockets are still nice and snug zero click.
Just use it every time right from the start if your main die doesn’t squeeze enough. It takes a lot I believe my PB die is a 437. I’d have to check it

Prior to this method I’ve had primers fall out going to the line after 5 or 6 firings at that powder charge

If you can get a manageable system that allows you to work up there the guns just shoot much better especially at 200 and magically stay in tune better
Click to expand...

Tom, I get more firings from PPC cases by using that die setup I made with no shoulder. I got the idea from Charles Huckabe.
I just take a standard Redding body die and bore the shoulder out of it. What is left is a die with just a tapered body.
Using a Arbor Press, I push the case in all the way flush, then using a rod, I pressing it back out. It hits the body pretty aggressively and allows the case a new lease on life.

Except for primer pockets. I rarely have one that simply falls out, but they have very little feel going in.

I have made one of these for both BR and PPC cases.
 
jackie schmidt said:
Tom, I get more firings from PPC cases by using that die setup I made with no shoulder. I got the idea from Charles Huckabe.
I just take a standard Redding body die and bore the shoulder out of it. What is left is a die with just a tapered body.
Using a Arbor Press, I push the case in all the way flush, then using a rod, I pressing it back out. It hits the body pretty aggressively and allows the case a new lease on life.

Except for primer pockets. I rarely have one that simply falls out, but they have very little feel going in.

I have made one of these for both BR and PPC cases.
Click to expand...

Jackie,
Once you have run the cases through like this, do they last as long as new cases do and would you do it a second time around or is it a one time deal?

John
 
John B said:
Jackie,
Once you have run the cases through like this, do they last as long as new cases do and would you do it a second time around or is it a one time deal?

John
Click to expand...

I’m not sure. I can get several more firings before they start acting up again.
The primer pockets are the problem.at the pressures we shoot in that upper window, they are not going to survive forever.
 
I seem to recall

some discussion about some sort of ring die that pushes the base of cases in and restores the primer pocket fit. Perhaps someone with a better memory can chime in.

Pete
 
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