Problems with my new ppc

Yes Nader and I spoke yesterday.

I still cant get the redding SB bushing die to set the shoulder back on the 220 R brass enough to chamber.

But I have a standard FL die for my 22ppc, so I FL sized the new brass in the 22ppc die, and now it chambers.

I still have to expand and neck turn-I hope this will enable me to FF my new brass.


I have the Ratigan book, the Newick book and a few others and I do read instructions
 
On the 77211 die. My experience. And the 7th reload. The brass was sticky. I have a used rifle, also.
I screwed the die in. And ram past over cam. So I called Redding. The tech told me there is .005" play on the bottom of the die. I could send the die to them. For free, he would "polish the bottom". Polish was with 600 grit sandpaper. I did this myself. I removed .001". Ran the sticky brass in. All good now. I now have a custom die.
Here's something New from Sinclair. I made my own. So I can't give a yay or nay. Bumb gage. I hear Harrell's give you one with their dies.
http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=search&item=09-1000&type=store
http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=search&item=09-10XX&type=store
It's cool, that you got the 220R brass to load.
Have fun. :)
 
Hi Boyd.
Yes I did. The shoulder did not move. Or very little. Less than .005".
I removed about .0015" from the bottom of the die. Works great. Thanks.
 
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zippy06 said:
Hi Boyd.
Yes I did. The shoulder did not move. Or very little. Less than .005".
I removed about .0015" from the bottom of the die. Works great. Thanks.
Click to expand...

5 thou is 'WAYY TOO MUCH!!

You need to keep bump at a thou or less IMO.

al
 
Zippy,
Perhaps you misplaced a zero? As Al said, .005 would be considered more than twice too much, five times what is usually the standard for Benchrest bump. I have run into this before. The truth is that if you cannot get the bolt closure that you need with a .001 bump, as compared with a case that is tight at the shoulder, you need another die, because yours is too large at the back for your chamber. That is why Lynwood Harrell is in business. At this moment he probably has a dozen different versions of a 6PPC die on the shelf, and if you send him a tight fired case, he will match it with the correct die. They are a bargain.
 
Well after I resized my new 220 R with my 22ppc die it chambers, but after I expand the neck it wont chamber.

Apparently the Redding small base bushing FL die wont push the shoulder back enough to chamber

I've ordered a body die from Sinclairs as per their tech Bob
 
According to Redding, the 6PPC USA was the designation given to the factory Sako and Savage rifles chambered in 6PPC. The reamers used to chamber these rifles are quite a bit larger than the reamers used on a standard competition benchrest rifle. I've been using the Redding small base full length size die. I set up as indicated, I screw it down just enough so a case will chamber easily in my rifle.
 
OK, now where did PPC USA come from??

First of all, I've owned 4 PPC USA rifles AND ALL WERE DIFFERENT! They WOULD NOT all use the same die and settings.

Secondly, I've used 5 different 6PPC reamers, again ALL DIFFERENT. AGAIN they will not interchange.

You CANNOT just "keep screwing the die down until it chambers" (even to the point of grinding off the die) and hope you're right!

You've first of all got to MEASURE shoulder setback ........ somehow, some way it must be measured. THEN you can go after the other stuff.

If anybody here in this thread or anybody READING this thread experiences a casehead separation, please post here so we can fix it.....BEFORE someone gets hurt......

al
 
Case goes in the chamber. Close bolt, it goes 1/2 way closed. Easy.
What is that????
Sounds to me, like bolt pushes case shoulder, into the chamber.
Bolt closes. head of case is on the bolt head. Shoulder is hard against the the chamber.
What am I missing????????
 
zippy06 said:
Case goes in the chamber. Close bolt, it goes 1/2 way closed. Easy.
What is that????
Sounds to me, like bolt pushes case shoulder, into the chamber.
Bolt closes. head of case is on the bolt head. Shoulder is hard against the the chamber.
What am I missing????????
Click to expand...

First of all, try previewing before posting and it may help with the doubles... :) .... I had this problem a couple wks ago and posted here about it. pita

Ok, a couple posts ago you said that after 7reloads your extraction was "sticky" which indicates swelling at the BASE of the case, not the shoulder. Too tight at the shoulder exhibits as "excess drag on uplift" not "sticky."

Then you posted that the shoulder moved "less than .005" ....... THIS IS TOO MUCH! Now if you measured it at "less than .0005" then we may be onto something but SOMETHING here isn't jiving! :)

Now you've posted that your bolt handle DROPS halfway and then gets stiff?

OR, does it get stiff HALFWAY IN???

Either one indicates a different condition than can be resolved by just screwing the die down.


IF you can run the bolt clear closed, drop the bolt handle down 1/2 way, and pull it back up and easily extract the case then maybe you're in tall cotton... :) ... but you DO have tapered lug seats which is another matter entire.

What's important is to KNOW that it's the shoulder that's binding up, not somewhere else.

al
 
alinwa said:
First of all, try previewing before posting and it may help with the doubles... :) .... I had this problem a couple wks ago and posted here about it. pita

Ok, a couple posts ago you said that after 7reloads your extraction was "sticky" which indicates swelling at the BASE of the case, not the shoulder. Too tight at the shoulder exhibits as "excess drag on uplift" not "sticky."
I was just going to post this. I checked my notes. We are talking apples and oranges.

Then you posted that the shoulder moved "less than .005" ....... THIS IS TOO MUCH! Now if you measured it at "less than .0005" then we may be onto something but SOMETHING here isn't jiving! :)
Maybe.

Now you've posted that your bolt handle DROPS halfway and then gets stiff?
No. falls easy. Then closes firmly.

OR, does it get stiff HALFWAY IN???
Either one indicates a different condition than can be resolved by just screwing the die down.


IF you can run the bolt clear closed, drop the bolt handle down 1/2 way, and pull it back up and easily extract the case then maybe you're in tall cotton... :) ... but you DO have tapered lug seats which is another matter entire.
Not sure about this. Tapered lugs????
What's important is to KNOW that it's the shoulder that's binding up, not somewhere else.

al
Click to expand...

Al. I understand what you are saying.
I have a .003" shim for new to hard to open brass. Remove the shim on new brass WOW. Bad JU JU. Shoulder moved .012"
On hard to open brass. It works. shouldn't but does. Then I put the shim back.
I must be doing something right. My first Score 200y. tournament. I got 250-5X.
Thanks for the help. I am all ears. Maybe to much ears. This is a major Hi-jack.
Sorry Codeman for the hijack.
 
Working with NEW 6ppc BRASS NOW

Codeman said:
I FL sized the NEW BRASS in the 22ppc die, and now it chambers.

I still have to expand and neck turn-I hope this will enable me to FF my new brass.
Click to expand...
Remove some metal from the shell holder so you can push the shoulder back using your small base Redding 6ppc die.
 
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New 6PPC Brass NOT Neck Turned????

Codeman said:
Well after I resized my new 220 R with my 22ppc die it chambers, but AFTER I EXPAND THE NECK IT WON'T CHAMBER

Apparently the Redding small base bushing FL die wont push the shoulder back enough to chamber
Click to expand...
Did you turn the brass OR JUST EXPAND IT? Remember, a bushing die does NOT size all the way to the shoulder. You need to size using a standard (no bushing) FL type die before expanding and turning. It may be better to fire form first using a filler & no bullet, or a 22caliber bullet , then neck turn your brass. That way you will know where the neck shoulder junction is located.
 
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I'm sitting here at work thinking did I expand and neck turn or did I just expand and try to chamber. (I only tried this on one case to see if it would work)

Gotta get home and see

Ive got a 6ppc body die on the way for sizing virgin 220 brass

Hopefully this will get me ready to FF

I'm planning on using the SB bushing FL die for my normal FL sizing if I can set it up to bump just right
 
Hello Codeman, I am Having the Same problem, I have a weber action, Broughton barrel in 6ppc .261 neck. I used a K&M expand iron to expand my 220 russian brass up to 6mm to turn the necks. Now I cant chamber the brass, nor will it chamber a non expanded 220 russian brass. Let me know how you fixed, or how you are going to fix your problem.
thanks Bob
 
Some good close up pictures of your expanded turned cases showing the neck shoulder junction would really help. The only place that an expanded turned .220 Russian case will hit in a 6PPc chamber, assuming that the OAL of the case doesn't give it a problem at the neck end of the chamber, is where the neck meets the shoulder. This is because of the difference in shoulder angle and diameter between the .220 Russian and the 6PPC. If you do not complete your cut on the shoulder properly, you will probably have a problem. Words can only go so far. We need to see your work to see if it is properly done. If it has been, the only other way to go is a one piece FL die to bump the case a little in this area. This would probably have to be done by feel, because of the difference in shoulder angles, and the part of the case being bumped.
 
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