Outside neck cleaning

Vern

Vern

Morethan1waytoskinacat
Curiosity.
In 1980 I traded for a 6x47 tight neck BR rifle. My first real BR rifle.
I sighted it in and then went to a match. I took a piece of green scrubber to clean the carbon on the outside of the necks with. I thought it worked great, until about halfway through the match, instead of being able to seat bullets without having to resize the bullets began to fall down the necks. They were finger looooose. There was no sizer die for the gun as it was a tight neck.
I asked one of the experienced shooters and they told me that I had changed the neck thickness just enough that there was no longer enough tension after firing to hold them because of having used the green pad.

That said now days I see a lot of guys using a brass brush or different things to clean the inside of the necks, and using steel wool to clean the outside. This being done after each firing it would seem like that after a few cleanings that the neck thickness would begin to change.
Since all I use to clean the outside of my necks is the die wax on my fingers I dont have anything to check.

Has anyone ever monitored the neck thickness after having done this for a few firings to see if it changes?
 
Vern ...

Vern said:
Curiosity.
In 1980 I traded for a 6x47 tight neck BR rifle. My first real BR rifle.
I sighted it in and then went to a match. I took a piece of green scrubber to clean the carbon on the outside of the necks with. I thought it worked great, until about halfway through the match, instead of being able to seat bullets without having to resize the bullets began to fall down the necks. They were finger looooose. There was no sizer die for the gun as it was a tight neck.
I asked one of the experienced shooters and they told me that I had changed the neck thickness just enough that there was no longer enough tension after firing to hold them because of having used the green pad.

That said now days I see a lot of guys using a brass brush or different things to clean the inside of the necks, and using steel wool to clean the outside. This being done after each firing it would seem like that after a few cleanings that the neck thickness would begin to change.
Since all I use to clean the outside of my necks is the die wax on my fingers I dont have anything to check.

Has anyone ever monitored the neck thickness after having done this for a few firings to see if it changes?
Click to expand...

FULL LENGTH SIZE with a BUSHING TYPE DIE [to reset neck tension] each time you reload your cases and you won't have that problem, and, your brass will love you for it. It won't matter what you clean the outside with.

Henry Rivers uses steel wool to clean his cases. He keeps on winning and has used the same brass for years. Check this out: http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek034.html. See his Case Prep and Reloading Methods. :)
 
Vern

What you mentioned is the reason guys keep a selection of neck sizing bushings to keep the desired bullet tension. Firing cases causes more change in what some call neck thickness than cleaning necks. I use Never Dull always have it is a mild abrasive that cleans without removing metal.

I recently have been vibrating my cases in walnut/corn for 15 minutes. I don't go for shiney cases just clean ones.

Stephen Perry
Angeles BR
 
Outside case neck cleaning...

Vern...I use a mixture of Shooters Choice & Kroil on a shop rag...works great. I also clean the outside case necks before leaving the range so the carbon is still easy to wipe off thereby minimizing staining of the brass.
Good luck...good shooting...gpoldblue
 
Krazy Kloth for the neck outsides & a nylon brush on an electric screwdriver for the insides. Full length resize with a bushing die & the neck tension remains pretty consistent.....
 
For years I used Never Dull to clean the outside of the necks, and then used a well worn brass brass and threaded some Never Dull into the brush to clean the inside of the neck. Yes it was a little messy, but seating a bullet was SMOOTH!

I recently changed to using steel wool on the outside, and kinda did the same with the steel wool where I wound some thin wool onto a brush for the inside of the neck, and I even took a cordless drill to a couple matches and used that to spin the brush in the necks. After a few firings, I noticed a definite increase in seating a bullet effort, even using the drill to clean with. The outside cleaned well by hand.

So, for kicks, I went back to what I used to do, Never Dull inside and out, on the same cases that seating was difficult. One hit with the Never Dull and seating a bullet was once again SMOOTH.

Does it make a difference? The way I've been shooting recently, who knows! But there is that "feel good" thing each time I seat a bullet.

And I doubt seriously Never Dull will remove brass from the case. Try it just for the hell of it.
 
I guess I am not communicating well today

I really do appreciate all the replies but I am not looking for ways to clean the outside neck though I do see a couple of alternatives for cleaning the insides that i like. Thanks.

I had the gun back in the early 80's.
Dont have it any more

The thing I was looking for was if anyone who uses green scrubbers or steel wool has ever gone back after 5+ loadings and miked the neck and found any diff. in the neck thickness.

As to the necking all I owned at that time for br was the gun and the brass and seater die that came with it. So back then a neck sizing die was not an option along with the fact that a tight neck should be just that, you should not be having to size the neck if its a tight neck.
 
"tight neck"

Vern,
The answer to your question is no. What you were doing should not affect the neck diameter of the brass in five firings. We need a little more info as to what was going on to really figure out what was happening. Was this the first time the brass was fired?
Exactly what is the neck diameter of your rifle and what is the diameter of your loaded rounds? Measured with a good mic. Saying you have a tight neck doesn't mean you shouldn't size. What kind of dies are you using?
With the kind of tolerances you re talking about it is critical to know the answers to these questions.
 
Vern

I know I have accidentally gotten brass too thin by using steel wool and turning cases with my drill. How coarse were those green pads?
 
I doubt that you thinned the necks that much cleaning them by hand. Tight necked does not necessarily mean that you don't have to size necks. Most have to be. If the neck does not have to be sized to hold a bullet at the desired tension, I believe the term is fitted neck, a subset of tight necked chambers that is arrived at by the the thickness that brass is turned to. This practice is not very common these days. I use 0000 steel wool to clean the outside of case necks (by hand). It works just fine.
 
I've been using either Krazy Kloth or upper engine cleaner on an old piece of towelling. Both clean off the carbon without removing metal.

I have backed off using the Kloth lately because it's a two step process - clean then wipe off the residue - & because I suspect that long term, it will reduce the neck some because it takes away the surface oxidation too.
 
Vern,

I totally understand where you are coming from. Any material removed from the outside of the neck, will result in changes on the inside of the neck. If the outside of the neck has had enough material removed that "tight neck" seating no longer works, than obviously your necks are thinner. Are they consistant, Probably not. But that has changed, now we have bushing dies to control the outside dimension, Right? Wrong.

Even with the bushing dies, (which size from the outside) if your necks vary in thickness you'll have some cases with more or less bullet tension than others. The only way to keep the necks close to the same thickness which includes carbon build up, is to clean them with a non abrasive cleaner inside and out. Or replace them often. An alternative could be an inside sizing button, to keep insides of necks the same size but if the thicknesses are different the bullet tension will still vary.

Our friend, (the Late Dave Dohrmann) proved with his gadgets that clean necks, inside and out show more consisitant bullet seating tension. Did it prove to be more accurate? He claimed he had better results on the target, he kept a lot of information so I tend to believe his tests.

Paul
 
Vern ...

Vern said:
The thing I was looking for was if anyone who uses green scrubbers or steel wool has ever gone back after 5+ loadings and miked the neck and found any diff. in the neck thickness.
Click to expand...

Why don't you be the first to do the measurements and then report back and tell us what you found? ;)
 
pbike said:
Our friend, (the Late Dave Dohrmann) proved with his gadgets that clean necks, inside and out show more consisitant bullet seating tension. Did it prove to be more accurate? He claimed he had better results on the target, he kept a lot of information so I tend to believe his tests.

Paul
Click to expand...

Your post was the first I had heard of Dave's passing. I am very sad to find this out, as Dave was a true contributor to our sport.....

He was obsessed with making us all better shooters, he will be truly missed.....
 
Dave was one of the "good guys". An asset and friend to all that had the pleasure of knowing him.

Paul
 
abintx

I dont use steel wool or anything abrasive.
To date I just use imperial and rub the necks when I am applying the wax.
This takes off the majority of the carbon just by using my fingers
Then every couple of matches I drop them in the ultrasonic and that gets rid of all the carbon every where.

It was just a curiosity thing watching others and knowing what I experienced 30 years ago.

Unfortunately after I traded for that gun and shot that match they disbanded the club in favor of competition pistol shooting and so I traded off the gun and hopes (at that time) of BR shooting for a pistol to compete with.
 
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