More on tuners and V V N-133

R

Richard

Member
I have totally dedicated myself to shooting Loker tuners for the last five years. The reason I went with Darrel's tuners is because of the tensioned nut system that allows turning the tuner with no tools required at the firing line.

I have not changed the amount of powder thrown for years. I have shot from 30 deg to over 100 deg, humidities from a bone dry 10% to almost 95% and never changed the powder throw. I know it sounds like voodoo but I can change the tuner and tell you exactly what the group will print. I once showed Rex Reneau at a match what it would do. I could dial in a mid zero and then I would say that on the next group I would dial in a half bullet of verticle. The next group I would dial in a full bullet of verticle. Then I could bring it right back to what I wanted.
No, I haven't shot zero aggs, but my stuff will shoot nice teen aggs in readable conditions.

What I have found is that if a person is really dedicated to learning what a tuner will do for you it will work.
I know some will tune for the widest window and tune with powder and that's fine. That's a good system also.

Anyway, just some food for thought. For those of you that don't know me I do shoot benchrest with a capital "B"

Richard Brensing
 
Regarding Kestrel machines - - -

FBecigneul said:
Of course. Capital B as in Brensing and Becigneul.
I've been doing the same with the Beggs Tuner and H4198 in a .30BR and the 6PPC and N133. Life is good. We tune based on the reading for the DA on a Kestrel as directed by the Gospel according to Gene.
Click to expand...

I had one for a couple of years but the one I had would never settle down to a firm reading so I could not seem to tell what the DA was. Was something wrong with the Kestrel or was there an adjustment some place I didn't know about? I would like to use DA with the Rimfire guns but don't know how to proceed with obtaining a reliable machine.

Pete
 
powder charge weight

Andy,

I am shooting 28.6 grs of N-133 lot# 26608 right now. I used to shoot 788-04 with the same weight and everything tuned the same.

Richard Brensing
 
I had the exact same experience as Richard over 5 years and 8 barrels equipped with Beggs tuners. 27.9 gr of N133 behind a half dozen different bullets at hard jam. 10 degrees to 105 degrees, Phoenix, Raton, Grand Junction, St Louis, and a lot of ranges in between. Dial-a-Group-Shape.

Using an Excel spreadsheet feature to reverse engineer a formula and came up with a simple generalization: Move the tuner about 1-1/4 thousandths (.00125") per degree of temp change. Easier to think of as .006" for 5 degrees which is 2 "clock numbers" if you're threaded at 28TPI. Simple. not perfect, but close enough to keep the gun in tune. [Rail gun tuner was even more predictable, but needed only .0005"/degree].

I've gotten away from the tuner for this past year. Good barrels really made the tuner shine, but I felt that I got too dependent on it to fix everything. A tuner on a mediocre barrel is still a mediocre performer, and I found myself not paying attention to all the other details necessary to shoot well in broad range of conditions, styles, etc. Had to go back to basics for a bit and learn how to work with the new powders, powder measure and seating depth adjustments. I've got new barrels on the rack and I will fit them all for tuners when I get they come online.

Rod Brown
 
I tried tracking

all of that stuff. Temp, barometric pressure, altitude, humidity, phase of the moon :) I gave up on all of that. I decided that instead of telling the rifle what it needed I would give it what it wanted. Big, Big difference.

Out at Raton this weekend I was telling Lowell Frei that with the conditions we had at 200 in the morning I was going to dial in .350 worth of verticle. My first group was a .352 all verticle. It's really not that hard once you let the rifle be the boss and not yourself.

Richard
 
For your guys that don't know Richard, he is one of the nicest guys in benchrest. Unassuming and mild mannered. But now he is starting to exert himself on the score sheet, second this past weekend to Gene at Raton. There are few people in in benchrest that shoot as much as Richard. I ask him last weekend how many barrels he had been through since he he stared shooting benchrest and he said at least 40. Richard hasn't been shooting that long. He lives in western Kansas and has his own range on his ranch. If you are not aware, the wind blows in Western Kansas. I guess what I am trying to get across is that Richard knows what he is talking about on this subject. Gene does it differently and no doubt it works, Richard does it his way and it works. That is the beauty of benchrest. To close, it is not true that Richard Brensing and Larry Scharnhorst are twins. Richard is just slightly taller.
Rex
 
Richard is only a foot taller than Larry. Richard and Dave Coots are about the same height, Coots says if he wants to talk to Larry face to face, Larry has to stand on a chair.
 
Poor Larry

He gets abused when he can't even stand up for himself. Well, standing or sitting...... I can't really tell the difference :)

Richard
 
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