Hydraulic case forming
- Thread starter Centerfire
- Start date
L
LASER
Guest
Paul,
That would necessitate a lot of clean-up. The water works fine, really. I just blow out the die and am good to go. When I'm finished I spray it down with Balistol and put it back in it's case. Done The IPA idea of Mr. Mock got me thinking. It would evaporate and perhaps be less messy. I whack the loaded die with a 2lb dead blow hammer and some spray emits. This is fixed by putting a towel over the die.
Tim
That would necessitate a lot of clean-up. The water works fine, really. I just blow out the die and am good to go. When I'm finished I spray it down with Balistol and put it back in it's case. Done The IPA idea of Mr. Mock got me thinking. It would evaporate and perhaps be less messy. I whack the loaded die with a 2lb dead blow hammer and some spray emits. This is fixed by putting a towel over the die.
Tim
L
LASER
Guest
Ray,
To reply to your "..it's your time and money..." I can form fifty cases much quicker than I can load, go to the range, clean etc. I also spent nada on components,
Tim
I hydraulically formed my 6mm Dasher brass. What a PITA!
I do my own work so I simply made the mandrel and a shellholder with no hole in the bottom and used my existing full length sizing die.
I used oil and installed used primers in the brass. Oil was MUCH better for forming but a hellofa lot harder to clean up. The used primers kept the pressure up and made less mess. I should have made the shellholder with a tight fitting bump plug in the middle to seal the primer hole and made the rim that much higher so I could still slide the brass in. I had the shellholder already made and I guess was too stubborn to make another.
One whack with a 4lb maul made a sharp neck to shoulder junction, every time. The case headspaced off this junction perfectly. Absolutely ZERO web stretch when firing because of the solid headspacing contact point. The shoulder and shoulder to case body junction was rounded so fireforming is absolutely required.
I did not have to clean inside the die during the process, oil did not wrinkle cases or leave dimples.
I chambered a junk 243 barrel on a cheap rifle and used it to fireform. It took almost full loads with bullets to fireform, I was very surprised.
I had some primers killed because all of the oil was not removed. This was also a surprise, there was no visible oil, just an oily smell and surface shine inside the cases. Stored bullet down and fired immediately solved this problem.
After culling 2 cases out of several hundred I had ZERO case failures of any type after many many firings. I did anneal after awhile because the barss was getting hard and the bolt was harder to close and very hard to close on some. This is normal or better than expected, these Lapua cases were obviously made very well at the factory to thrive after all the abuse I gave them.
I tried other methods prior to hydraulically forming but did not have the results I wanted.
I am certain I will not be dicking around with a chambering that requires special treatment ever again, I have much better things to do.
I do my own work so I simply made the mandrel and a shellholder with no hole in the bottom and used my existing full length sizing die.
I used oil and installed used primers in the brass. Oil was MUCH better for forming but a hellofa lot harder to clean up. The used primers kept the pressure up and made less mess. I should have made the shellholder with a tight fitting bump plug in the middle to seal the primer hole and made the rim that much higher so I could still slide the brass in. I had the shellholder already made and I guess was too stubborn to make another.
One whack with a 4lb maul made a sharp neck to shoulder junction, every time. The case headspaced off this junction perfectly. Absolutely ZERO web stretch when firing because of the solid headspacing contact point. The shoulder and shoulder to case body junction was rounded so fireforming is absolutely required.
I did not have to clean inside the die during the process, oil did not wrinkle cases or leave dimples.
I chambered a junk 243 barrel on a cheap rifle and used it to fireform. It took almost full loads with bullets to fireform, I was very surprised.
I had some primers killed because all of the oil was not removed. This was also a surprise, there was no visible oil, just an oily smell and surface shine inside the cases. Stored bullet down and fired immediately solved this problem.
After culling 2 cases out of several hundred I had ZERO case failures of any type after many many firings. I did anneal after awhile because the barss was getting hard and the bolt was harder to close and very hard to close on some. This is normal or better than expected, these Lapua cases were obviously made very well at the factory to thrive after all the abuse I gave them.
I tried other methods prior to hydraulically forming but did not have the results I wanted.
I am certain I will not be dicking around with a chambering that requires special treatment ever again, I have much better things to do.
pbike
New member
In my normal brass uniforming regimen, (which I should add doesn't included hydrolic forming) but includes; primer pocket uniforming, flash hole deburring, case oal trimming, neck turning, and inside and outside case neck deburring, I wash the cases before loading and firing. The wash we use is the Iosso case cleaning system. After the cases are washed and rinsed they are boiled in a screen collinder to keep them off the bottom of the pot and keep them only at the 212 degrees of the boiling water. After they have been in the boiling water and I feel the cases are up to 212, I shake the water out of the collinder, and dump the warm cases on a towel to dry. This acomplishes a few things, any chips of brass that may have found their way into the case are washed out, so is any residual oil. The cases dry on the towel and I blow air into them to ensure all the water is out of the primer pocket, and flash hole, there is occasionally a drop of water. With the cases now being just less than 212, they dry all the water up rather quickly. I would continue to do this process even if I moved to hydrolic forming for certain chamberings. What I am saying is, the oil from hydrolic die forming would be warshed clean anyway, wouldn't it?
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C
Cheechako
Guest
I was questioning the need to fire-form each case 3 times. It sounds like you guys are making a bunch of cases for live varmint shooting which makes me ask a further question. "Why the need to fire-form at all?" A case full of powder and a bullet is all you need. You can shoot at those dogs and fire-form at the same time.
Or, simply ask your friendly Benchrest shooting buddy for his used brass. He'd probably give you a thou just to get rid of them. The PDs won't know the difference.
JMHO
Ray
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L
LASER
Guest
Actually
I saw an article about the hydraulic forming die and thought it was pretty neat. I really got it for that reason. Having used it for only several hundred cases(600 yd IBS, no pd's)
it still seems like the cat's ptouie. Don't have to go to the range, spend money on components, no wasted rounds down a good barell etc. Seems like a no brainer to me. I have a fireform bbl to put on and shoot 'em first time at ground hog shoots. I wish I never heard how good a job the oil does' tho. Will be forced to try it because I am a bonehead.
Tim
I saw an article about the hydraulic forming die and thought it was pretty neat. I really got it for that reason. Having used it for only several hundred cases(600 yd IBS, no pd's)
it still seems like the cat's ptouie. Don't have to go to the range, spend money on components, no wasted rounds down a good barell etc. Seems like a no brainer to me. I have a fireform bbl to put on and shoot 'em first time at ground hog shoots. I wish I never heard how good a job the oil does' tho. Will be forced to try it because I am a bonehead.
Tim
Oil is a PITA. The clean up from oil makes it not worth the trouble. I have used water and isopropyl alcohol....and the alcohol is better. After forming the cases, I pour the alcohol back in the bottle. Next, I turn them neck down in a loading block and the alcohol will run out and evaporate. The Dasher is the only case that I use a hydraulic die to form. PPC cases do not need a die such as this. Good shooting....James
pbike, I used very hot water and soap, lots of it, twice. After the first firing the oil was completely burnt up.
I never tried alcohol, since oil is thicker than water, something thinner should be worse. Alcohol sure would be easy to clean up.
Water did work its just that oil was better and it is about the case forming properly not the effort required.
I never tried alcohol, since oil is thicker than water, something thinner should be worse. Alcohol sure would be easy to clean up.
Water did work its just that oil was better and it is about the case forming properly not the effort required.
pbike
New member
Absolutely! That was my thought... I'm gonna have to clean up the brass chips, and the oil from neck turning anyway right?
I've heard I can make an adapter that I just screw into the top of my sizing die and then make a shellholder without the hole through. Has anyone else seen these plans? Also doesn't it make sense to have a seperate press just to do this job... with the hammering etc., I'd hate to mess up a really good press just beating on the tops of dies?