Friend Gene Beggs:

K

Kathy

Guest
Friend Gene:

Been reading your post on "barrel indexing".......

Mirage.........................................I think you and I will understand..

Your friend, Bill Calfee
 
Kathy said:
Friend Gene:

Been reading your post on "barrel indexing".......

Mirage.........................................I think you and I will understand. Your friend, Bill Calfee
Click to expand...

"Mirage?" :eek: Yes Bill, I believe I understand what you're referring to. If I'm wrong, please correct me. :)

Guys, I hope Bill Calfee will not be offended by my sharing with you an interesting thing that happened some time ago. Some are put off by his style of writing, others dislike the way he sometimes talks in riddles and toots his own horn but I wanted to relate this little story that reveals a great deal about the character of our friend, Bill Calfee. :)

Some time ago, I wrote an article for Precision Shooting magazine entitled, "Reading Mirage." In that article, I stated that I did not believe the target image could be permanently displaced by mirage. Well, to make a long story short it certainly can and I was mistaken. :eek: In a second article entitled, "Mirage Revisited," I pointed out where I was wrong and related when, where and how I discovered the truth.

It was Bill Calfee who contacted Dave Brennan, the editor of Precision Shooting magazine and expressed his concern for our fellow shooters who would be mislead by my erroneous statement.

Dave forwarded Bill's letter to me and he and I had several interesting exchanges. Bill was a perfect gentleman about the situation and at no time was he rude or condescending toward me.

I'm wiser and shooters worldwide are better off because Bill Calfee stepped up and pointed out something that he knew was wrong.

If I'm mistaken about this barrel indexing thing that will be discovered soon enough, but I truly believe this is going to be the 'next big thing!'

Bill, my hat is off to you my friend. Thank you. :)

Gene Beggs
 
I think the difference is....

The difference is in the case of "Mirage"; when you realized you were wrong, you admitted it and went on from there. In this case of barrel indexing, you have furnished your theory, provided your solution, and EXACT directions of how to prove it to ourselves. Big difference!

With your inputs and explanations of how to try it for ourselves, we can be part of the experiment and see for ourselves if it works in our case or not.;)

Best of luck Gene,
Virg
 
No the Difference

is that Bill needs his Ego stroked once again. It's a good thing that Bill does not believe in indexing.

Later,
Bobby
 
Friend Gene:

Been testing SPEC 6 today.......windy.....

First off, I want to thank you, again, for the Wind Probe you sent me....it's awesome!

Gene, when I read you fine thread on "Barrel indexing", the first poster, after you, used my name................then my name was used a couple more times...

My dear friend Gene, either I'm giving you a bad name, or, you're giving me one..................

"Barrel Indexing"

Gene, If I thought I could index my barrels and improve my accuracy, I would spend everything I have to do so.......I am going to do whatever it takes to put the finest guns, in the world, in the hands of my customers......period!

Over the last couple years, I ran the most exhaustive tests that a human could possibly devise, and published them, to see if indexing a barrel would improve accuracy.......

Thank you again my friend for the Wind Probe....

Your friend, Bill Calfee
 
Kathy said:
Over the last couple years, I ran the most exhaustive tests that a human could possibly devise, and published them, to see if indexing a barrel would improve accuracy.......
Click to expand...
Bill
you made the comment at one point that there was no way to index a threaded barrel. I told you then that there was. Gene has again demonstrated it. Apparently your tests were not that exhaustive.
Though you have made great strides in other areas, one gunsmith does not the entire base of knowledge make.

Now if I could just find someone that would explore the LIDAR wind probe I envisioned 10 years ago...well mirage would no longer be an issue either.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Kathy said:
Friend Gene:

Been testing SPEC 6 today.......windy.....

First off, I want to thank you, again, for the Wind Probe you sent me....it's awesome!

Gene, when I read you fine thread on "Barrel indexing", the first poster, after you, used my name................then my name was used a couple more times...

My dear friend Gene, either I'm giving you a bad name, or, you're giving me one..................

"Barrel Indexing"

Gene, If I thought I could index my barrels and improve my accuracy, I would spend everything I have to do so.......I am going to do whatever it takes to put the finest guns, in the world, in the hands of my customers......period!

Over the last couple years, I ran the most exhaustive tests that a human could possibly devise, and published them, to see if indexing a barrel would improve accuracy.......

Thank you again my friend for the Wind Probe....

Your friend, Bill Calfee
Click to expand...


Bill, you and I are about the same age and have a lot in common. Your passion is rimfire score, mine is centerfire group. Even though rifles are rifles and all share a lot of the same characteristics, there is a difference between rimfire and centerfire. The fact that my experiences with barrel indexing have been quite contrary to what you have found with rimfire barrels bears this out.

You and me giving each other a bad name?? :eek: Nah, no way! And besides; who cares? One good thing about gettin' old is the fact that you just don't worry about the small stuff anymore and you know what; it's all small stuff. :D Sure, just laugh about it, mosey on down the pathway of life, tell the truth, do the best you can and don't worry about the rest. :)

My Dad had a saying that makes more sense to me the older I get. When I made a mistake or something went wrong he would say,

"Aw 'ell son, don't worry about it; a hunerd years from now it won't make any difference."

And you know; he was right. :D

Later,

Gene Beggs
 
Friend Gene:

Friend Gene:

I quote from you my friend:

"Bill, you and I are about the same age and have a lot in common. Your passion is rimfire score, mine is centerfire group. Even though rifles are rifles and all share a lot of the same characteristics, there is a difference between rimfire and centerfire."

Gene, let me pull that last line, of your quote, again, please my friend:

"there is a difference between rimfire and centerfire."

Yes, there are differences between rimfire and centerfire, but, absolutely not when it comes to "BARREL INDEXING".............

Gene, I apologize my friend, but, neither me or you, as old as we are, even if we were 18 year olds, will ever see "Barrel Indexing" in common practice in accuracy development..........

Because it simply has no validity.....

Gene, how can a dumb guy like Bill Calfee make the above statement? Cause it's true my dear friend.....Mirage....

I love your passion Gene...maybe you'll prove the laws of physics wrong...

Your friend, ALWAYS, Bill Calfee
 
I maby am or not as old as--

You guys, but there are only two rocks up on the hillside behind my house as old as me, and I told the big guy where to put one of them. ONE of the things I learned in all these years is to NEVER tell somone "THAT WONT WORK" because I didn't understand the principal or I wasn't willing to try with an open mind. The company I use to work for had an incentive program for new ideas or better procedures. I would maby implant an idea in my apprentices mind and they would come up a "new idea" because they didn't know it couldn't be done that way. Sure it took a little polishing before I submitted it for them, but my apprentices won three months in a row, for a multi-national construction company!
So instead of maby making the same mistakes over and over again, lets aproach indexing with an open mind.
I know I have had people who worked for me who would try their damnbest to make sure somthing didn't work.

GENE, you go guy!!!!!

Steve Moore
 
I index

rim-fire barrels as a standard practice. I have not run across a barrel that has been perfectly straight, that couldn't be indexed. On those that showed a definite index displacement, and by placing the bore curve vertically down, there has always been an improvement.

It takes a little extra work but if you plan to do it in the beginning of the process you eliminate all the convoluted work that Mr. Calfee went through. I use a universal/slave receiver that consumes very little of the barrel length before fitting the barrel to the desired action. I know several others who index successfully using straight forward methods and apparently there is only one who seemingly can't figure it out.

Although I've never done a center-fire I can't see why it wouldn't work relatively the same way. Good luck on the procedure.

Jeff
 
Kathy said:
Because it simply has no validity.....

I love your passion Gene...maybe you'll prove the laws of physics wrong...

Your friend, ALWAYS, Bill Calfee
Click to expand...
Bill
you've been wrong about the laws of physics before. :D
Seems practice does make for consistency.
 
Calfee World

I did not realize the Laws Of Physics even existed in CALFEE WORLD.
 
Friend Jeffrey

My friend:

I see by your post that you index barrels as "standard practice"..

My friend, you also state, next paragraph, that you know several others who use "straight forward methods", to properly index their rimfire barrels.....

Jeffrey, I'm always willing to learn.......absolutely!

I would be honored if you would care to share your secrets of properly indexing a rimfire rifle barrel so the results were conclusive.....and I would be doubly honored if some of your friends, you spoke of, who use their "straight forward" methods, of indexing a rimfire rifle barrel with conclusive results, would care to share their secrets......

Your friend, Bill Calfee
 
Conclusive indexing.

Bill:
I think that you are familiar with the process of indexing (or re-indexing a "killer" barrell).

First, you have to get your hands on a "killer" barrell that someone sends you to install on their rifle. Then you install the "killer" barrell on that rifle and post on this forum how "killer" it is.

Then you remove the "killer" barrell and replace it with a tomato stake. Then send the completed rifle with the tomato stake barrell to the original customer. The "killer" barrell goes somewhere else.

That's how you index barrells. Conclusively.

SteveM.
 
I wonder,,,hmmmmm,

Now Bill Calfee,,, with all this discussion of barrel indexing and in view of the fact that your reported experiences have been completely different to what I and others have found,,,, you wouldn't be trying to lead us away from some deep dark secret you have been guarding all these years; would you? ;) Nahh,, you wouldn't do anything like that; would you? :rolleyes:

Sure you would, you sneaky rascal !! :cool:

Come on now,, tell the truth; there is no way anyone could build all the championship winning rifles you have without a keen knowledge of barrel indexing. :D :D

That's okay Bill, most of us still love you. :D :D :D

Later,

Gene Beggs
 
Mr. Calfee, Bill or friend bill,
You have spent a lot of time and effort in the past attempting to discredit barrel indexing as a possible accuracy improvement. Your interest in it now confuses me. I fear there may be a hidden agenda in you pursuit. Until I'm certain that you are convinced there is, or could be, an accuracy advantage with indexing a barrel, I think I'll pass on the lesson.

Jeff
 
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