case trimming

abintx said:
Here was your question: Are you asking about case length trimming or case neck turning?

My response was only to point out that it was trimming. Since you state under your name that you're senile, I was only trying to help out, in case there was a little truth to your statement. :)
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I was inquiring into the thread originators question ""What is the way most Benrest shooters trim their cases . I never could get the small hand lathes to be consistant . Have been thinking abut the drill press . Maybe ya'll have a better way.Thanks for any info "".

He didn't say whether he wanted to trim length or diameter...
 
case trimming:

I found out this evening that case trimming needs to be done AFTER re-sizing. There is a substancial difference in case length after full length re-sizing.
 
Pete I have for some unknown reason always felt that trimming should be done after Full Length sizing. Had no reason as to why but felt that if anything the cases should be very close to the same after sizing. I am never in a rush when trimming or even neck turning. I do no more than 25 new cases in a day and it takes me a whole day to do them. I may turn a couple leave the turner to cool on the cement floor check on the sporting event of the day go back down and do a few more. I do not find it tedious. It is part of the benchrest process to try and ring the best out of your rig.

Calvin

Pete Wass said:
I found out this evening that case trimming needs to be done AFTER re-sizing. There is a substancial difference in case length after full length re-sizing.
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As time goes by

Calvin, have you noticed that some cases grow in length more than others as one uses them? I suspect it has something to do with the mixture of the amalgum; some are harder than others.

In Jack's tuning seminar he spent a lot of time talking about brass prep, length being prominrnt in that discussion. I heard him on that one; why I checked them after they were Full lenght resizes. Some of them grew .005 or so.
 
Think about the firing process. The danger in over length cases is that the case neck "can" pinch the bullet as it exits and cause excessive pressure. That being known, does the case expand to its maximum length before or after the bullet leaves its neck?

First, you need at least 0.010" clearance between case length and chamber length. In many 6PPC chamberings there is at least 0.025" between minimum chamber and maximum cartridge. For example, JGS 1045 (1.525") and Lapua 220 Russian, blown out (about 1.490"-1.500") depending on how the case was fire formed.

The prime safety consideration here is to not allow the cases to get too long. So beware. Beware of which chamber you have and what your cases are in OAL in their maximum length condition.
 
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I have wondered why folks don't have the .010 clearance put into their reamer when they have it ground?
 
Pete Wass said:
I have wondered why folks don't have the .010 clearance put into their reamer when they have it ground?
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Over time the Lapua and Sako brass has changed in factory length. Plus, depending on what method you use to form the cases will give you a variation in length by as much as 0.025" or so. And, the cases need to be trimmed all to the same length after a couple of fireformings.

As to neck diameters, I once ask Ferris Pindell why turn the brass to a 0,260" neck. He said that the brass several years ago required being turned to 0.260" to clean up.
 
Pete Wass said:
Calvin, have you noticed that some cases grow in length more than others as one uses them? I suspect it has something to do with the mixture of the amalgum; some are harder than others.

In Jack's tuning seminar he spent a lot of time talking about brass prep, length being prominrnt in that discussion. I heard him on that one; why I checked them after they were Full lenght resizes. Some of them grew .005 or so.
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Pete I have in my limited experience while loading for the PPC seen what Jack talks about in his seminar. Leave the cases at a longer trim length that there growth is quite different. I have not got into the depth of seeing how much difference there has been. I leave that up to the guys who have WAY more trigger time than I have ever had. I just returned some new brass to 2.5 thou total clearance cause I hit that in my first re adjustment. I also turned some to 3 thou total and am going to try it and see what happens. I have also started to trim the necks to 1.490. I used to keep them at 1.500-1.510. I have decided to make my daily routine starting the day with fresh trimmed cases. Will it or does it work? I have no idea but it does not take me much longer. If it keeps my mindset better so be it.

I respect Jack for what he has done with sharing his thoughts on what has worked for him. A man who is willing to put thoses thoughts out there truly BELIEVE'S in what he is doing WORKS. Since that seminar I have become even more anal with my brass prep. I struggled all year and spending the evening with him gave me some new light on the sport.
 
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JSchopper said:
Exactly. ;) Some just can't grasp what the written words mean. Some call it dyslexic, others senility....both are easily angered when corrected:D:rolleyes::eek:. They should )chill( out alttle
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Jeff Schopper your contribution to the subject of this thread is really helpful. I'm sure the author of this thread is much farther down the road in what he was trying to learn.

At least this time you are not hiding behind some CB handle like you normally do and like this abintx is doing. Have the guts to use your real name instead of hiding behind your mommy's skirts abintx!!
 
JerrySharrett said:
Jeff Schopper your contribution to the subject of this thread is really helpful. I'm sure the author of this thread is much farther down the road in what he was trying to learn.

At least this time you are not hiding behind some CB handle like you normally do and like this abintx is doing. Have the guts to use your real name instead of hiding behind your mommy's skirts abintx!!
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LOL Jerry, I see you rolled out of bed with a big :D on your face this am. I hope your aren't holding anything back, go get'em tiger grrrrrrrrrrrr.

Your Friend
Dan Honert
 
For trimming to length, there are many units from the forrester, to the Wilson and the you name it little lathes, to the hand held ones like Sinclair or Homer Strickland's unit that seems to chatter everytime I use them. These two are small and can fit in one hand while the case is in the other. No mass or fixture you have to push them together real tight and the length is adjustable and maintained by the shoulder, good in theory for fireformed brass. Another unit I rarely see anyone mention is the one Jim Goody builds. Appearantly he sent one to Dick W to be tested but Dick couldn't get it to work so it didn't make it to the magazine. Ours works fine. We chuck a fireformed case into our powered case turning motor, turn on the motor and trim to length. It is larger than Homer's or Sinclairs (Possum Hollow maybe) and you use 2 hands to hold the cutter, much like neck turning, but trimming and it's length is adjustable from the shoulder. I will show a picture or two.

Paul
 

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Just to give y'all something else to fret about:

Background: There is an ex-1,000 yard benchrest shooter named Jim Hardy (who has moved on to long-range prone and Palma), who can and does reload precision ammunition. His reloading room include a number of high-dollar items custom made for him by Ferris Pindell. And yes, Jim tests things.

Jim determined that the angle of the chamfer affects accuracy. He found a 45-degree chamfer best for flat-base bullets. I forget the preferred angle for boat-tails. And as I remember, he also felt he could shoot the difference between a *true* chamfer and an off-centered one, which means you have to use a tool that holds the case on center with the deburring tool.

Do I believe this? I believe the person holding the trophy gets credit for the win. Most everything else is up for grabs.
 
sooooooooo.......

For crowning my cases. Can I just use one of my barrel crowning grinds? I crown from the inside/out, power feed. I'll have to fiddle with the rpm's I suppose.

:D

al
 
Jerry ...

JerrySharrett said:
Jeff Schopper your contribution to the subject of this thread is really helpful. I'm sure the author of this thread is much farther down the road in what he was trying to learn. At least this time you are not hiding behind some CB handle like you normally do and like this abintx is doing. Have the guts to use your real name instead of hiding behind your mommy's skirts abintx!!
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Well, I guess this is what to expect from time to time, when one posts on a public forum. Regardless of chosen user name, it's a shame that an adult has to act like this.
 
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abintx said:
, it's a shame that an adult has to act like this.
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Yes Art it is. You and Jeff both seem to think you can be provocative and insult posters then make a joke of it.

It is also a shame that the Super Moderators allow personal attacks and say nothing!!!
 
JerrySharrett said:
Yes Art it is. You and Jeff both seem to think you can be provocative and insult posters then make a joke of it. It is also a shame that the Super Moderators allow personal attacks and say nothing!!!
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If I had to guess, I believe that all ensuing rhetoric and nonsense began here ...

"Well smart-mouth, I didn't see where he stated which part of the case he was trimming. Look up the dictionary definition of the word TRIMMING. It's listed there under the word TRIMMING!!!!"

Perhaps the moderators should have stepped in at that point. Lesson learned. Time to move on.
 
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JerrySharrett said:
It is also a shame that the Super Moderators allow personal attacks and say nothing!!!
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OK guys, I'll say something.

How about "put a lid on it"? That's milder than "Put a cork in it," right? But if that's still too strong, how about, "Now Johnny, play nice." Something like that.

Actually, if a moderator says anything, what usually happens is both sides get mad at him/her. Anything to deflect the anger, I suppose.
 
SShooterZ said:
I used the same thing. Can rip through 100 cases in no time and my hand/arms don't feel like I was working a jackhammer. :)
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The rotary stop on my Delta drill press gave less than acceptable results - about +/- 0.005" length. Some drill presses have a linear stop like a threaded rod with two jam nuts. Maybe they would work better. I like the Forster hand lathe with their 3-in-1 cutter that trims and chamfers inside and out all in one operation. RCBS has a similar cutter. They are faster and more consistent than three separate operations. The power trimmers look nice, but my arms need more exercise, not less.


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