Bix,n Andy Vs Jewel triggers

M

maxpower

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I have 2 new builds going together. One is a Panda in 6 Dasher for 1000yd LG + 6PPC for BR, the other is a Pierce in 300WSM for F Class. So far I have one trigger (a Jewel) for either and am looking for another. What is the real world benefit of a more expensive Bix,n Andy over the jewel?
What ever trigger I fit to the Panda will be set at 2oz, while the trigger in the Pierce will be set around 8 Oz. Would any of these triggers be more suited to either action? Is there any real benefit of the super expensive Bix,N Andy over a Jewel if it is going to be set at 2oz or 8oz?
 
maxpower said:
I have 2 new builds going together. One is a Panda in 6 Dasher for 1000yd LG + 6PPC for BR, the other is a Pierce in 300WSM for F Class. So far I have one trigger (a Jewel) for either and am looking for another. What is the real world benefit of a more expensive Bix,n Andy over the jewel?
What ever trigger I fit to the Panda will be set at 2oz, while the trigger in the Pierce will be set around 8 Oz. Would any of these triggers be more suited to either action? Is there any real benefit of the super expensive Bix,N Andy over a Jewel if it is going to be set at 2oz or 8oz?
Click to expand...

MAX: Go to the rimfire benchrest forum section and read the thread about Flavio Fare' triggers. I just bought 1 after buying 6 B&A triggers. Interesting reading and very true.
 
I have both, B&A and Jewel. Although I am not dissatisfied with the Jewel, I like the B&A better. The best way that I can describe the feel is that I do not think about my trigger at all. It is very consistent. When I got my B&A it was set at about 1 1/4 oz. which was lighter than I am used to. My Jewel is set at about 2 1/4 oz. After trying the B&A for a while, I decided to change the weight and ended up using the next heavier trigger spring from the one that was installed originally. I also decided that letting my trigger setting be determined by some arbitrary number was silly, so I set it up so that it felt right, whatever the weight might be. I have been shooting it that way for some time now, and can report that it is a real pleasure. For me, after a certain point, lighter is not better, but smoother and more consistent are. Now, when I am shooting, the trigger does not even enter my mind. I decide when I want the shot to happen, and the gun goes off. I am told that the B&A will stand reliably at under an ounce. I have not chosen to take mine there.
 
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maxpower said:
I have 2 new builds going together. One is a Panda in 6 Dasher for 1000yd LG + 6PPC for BR, the other is a Pierce in 300WSM for F Class. So far I have one trigger (a Jewel) for either and am looking for another. What is the real world benefit of a more expensive Bix,n Andy over the jewel?
What ever trigger I fit to the Panda will be set at 2oz, while the trigger in the Pierce will be set around 8 Oz. Would any of these triggers be more suited to either action? Is there any real benefit of the super expensive Bix,N Andy over a Jewel if it is going to be set at 2oz or 8oz?
Click to expand...



One huge benefit you will get with the BnA trigger irrespective of the trigger weight setting is that the upward force on the cocking piece is going to be significantly less. This is very important factor in terms of accuracy.

We have tested many triggers in the market (including the Jewells) and there is no trigger that even comes close to the BnA in terms of dropping that upward pressure. In some case the pressure is 10 times greater. With a Jewell it is about 4X.

This can be achieved in the BnA by using the ball system which holds a huge amount of downward force still using a very light reset spring.
 
I love my Jewell triggers, but my competition guns now all sport the BnAs. I would rank BnA triggers and Seb NEO rests as the two best investments you can make in your competition Benchrest setup. Expensive, but both make a difference that you can feel within a couple targets over their closest competitors. That doesn't mean that they are 'better', just that you can really feel the difference and sometimes that is what you need to take your game to the another level.

Rod
 
if 8 oz is all you need/want...look at/try a timney 700 tactical.
 
Dusty Stevens said:
If its gonna be 6-8oz why not go with a kelbly?
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Actually a Kelbly is another option I am looking at. Are they any more reliable than the others? I am more interested in reliability as this rifle can sometimes get a little dusty or get grass and crud in it when shooting belly benchrest (F class). Another shooter told me he had issues with a Kelbly (I think??) firing when he tried to close the bolt on a sticky case when set very light, not sure if other triggers do this as well?
 
Chris Harris said:
One huge benefit you will get with the BnA trigger irrespective of the trigger weight setting is that the upward force on the cocking piece is going to be significantly less. This is very important factor in terms of accuracy.

We have tested many triggers in the market (including the Jewells) and there is no trigger that even comes close to the BnA in terms of dropping that upward pressure. In some case the pressure is 10 times greater. With a Jewell it is about 4X.

This can be achieved in the BnA by using the ball system which holds a huge amount of downward force still using a very light reset spring.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot for this information Chris, it is the sort of information I was after.
 
Boyd Allen said:
I have both, B&A and Jewel. Although I am not dissatisfied with the Jewel, I like the B&A better. The best way that I can describe the feel is that I do not think about my trigger at all. It is very consistent. When I got my B&A it was set at about 1 1/4 oz. which was lighter than I am used to. My Jewel is set at about 2 1/4 oz. After trying the B&A for a while, I decided to change the weight and ended up using the next heavier trigger spring from the one that was installed originally. I also decided that letting my trigger setting be determined by some arbitrary number was silly, so I set it up so that it felt right, whatever the weight might be. I have been shooting it that way for some time now, and can report that it is a real pleasure. For me, after a certain point, lighter is not better, but smoother and more consistent are. Now, when I am shooting, the trigger does not even enter my mind. I decide when I want the shot to happen, and the gun goes off. I am told that the B&A will stand reliably at under an ounce. I have not chosen to take mine there.
Click to expand...
I was only after 6 to 8 oz, not anything super low like the true SR BR guns run, but I suppose if a B&A works well at 1 oz, then it will still be very reliable if I decide to make it slightly lighter than 6 oz, with regard to slam fires, closing bolts on sticky cases, grass, dust or crud in the trigger?
 
Jim Pag said:
MAX: Go to the rimfire benchrest forum section and read the thread about Flavio Fare' triggers. I just bought 1 after buying 6 B&A triggers. Interesting reading and very true.
Click to expand...

Yes it was a good read, a Flavio Fare is now another option, but so expensive. The Bix trigger gives less upward pressure on the sear than other triggers, but how do the FF triggers compare with upward pressure? How do they compare with Bix as far as reliability with slam fires or handling a bit of dust and crud in them when shooting on dirty F class mounds?
 
maxpower said:
Yes it was a good read, a Flavio Fare is now another option, but so expensive. The Bix trigger gives less upward pressure on the sear than other triggers, but how do the FF triggers compare with upward pressure? How do they compare with Bix as far as reliability with slam fires or handling a bit of dust and crud in them when shooting on dirty F class mounds?
Click to expand...

The upward pressure of the Flavio trigger's top sear we have measured is 1,500 grams (53 ounces) compared with the Bix 'n Andy of 300 grams (11 ounces). It is a pretty significant difference.


Chris
 
Maxpower,
I would never use a trigger or trigger setting that required careful handling, this includes the lightest settings.
 
Boyd Allen said:
Maxpower,
I would never use a trigger or trigger setting that required careful handling, this includes the lightest settings.
Click to expand...

That is a very good point Boyd. With the BnA one can take the weight down to as little as 5 grams (1/6 ounce!!) and still be sure there will be no slam fires BUT the trigger needs to be setup properly. I have had people bring rifles to me and I am astounded at how improperly the triggers are setup. It is a wonder that they function at all. But if one spends a little time and goes of the setup carefully then you will have a completely "safe" trigger. Saying that, no trigger is truly safe at 10 grams if the rifle is loaded and pointed in an unsafe direction.

The key in understanding the relationship between the sear setting and the trigger shoe spring setting. In short, adjust the trigger shoe setting to something fairly "heavy" (say 30 to 50 grams (1 to 1.5 ounce)), then set the sear to a safe adjustment where it is crisp but no slam fires even when one slams the bolt closed, then take the weight down as low as you are comfortable but all the time checking the sear hold by slamming the bolt closed fairly violently repeatedly. If it holds, you should be good in any match.

Chris
 
When I test trigger settings, I am more violent with the rifle than I would ever be actually loading it to shoot, under any circumstances. I slap the stock with the palm of my hand, thump the butt on the floor (carpeted if there is no rubber butt pad, and slam the bolt closed, repeatedly. I have never hurt a rifle doing this test, but it is intentionally extreme. I would much rather have a little creep than an unsafe trigger. Fortunately with the B&A I do not have to put up with one to get the other.
 
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