Barrel Crown

JGS makes those reamers, what I call a piloted center reamer. I would think Pacific Tool could also provide one.
 
gunsmither said:
I have used the Brownell 45 deg. Hand crowning tool many times with great results. I turn tight fitting pilots from Delrin tightly fit over the 3/16" drill rod pilot.
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If you want to try this, be sure to make the bushing. When I was young & foolish, I did a .22 RF barrel this way, without making a bushing. That drill rod "pilot" left gouges in the barrel.
 
I agree with G. Walley. Sharp flat crown has been my best. Chamfered crowns seem to make the bullet more wind sensitive. I tried chamfered crowns for awhile because I thought the cleaning rod or jag/brush wouldn't prematurely wear the edge. Didn't take me long to figure out something wasn't right.
 
I would sure like a definitive test that would actually determine if one crown is more accurate than another...

Something that would take the 'seems to make the bullet more wind sensitive' out of it...

Perhaps a quality shooter with a 'known' rifle with a flat crown shoot a couple of aggs in good conditions and at the range use a piloted 60 degree reamer and shoot a couple more aggs in the good conditions...

I would love it if Jackie would do it...
 
OK JD & Greg Dennis has stated that ONLY people of known abillity should do the test. How may years have you guys shot??? I know you didn't start yesterday !!!!!!! I think he has really made a dumb statement. :mad:
 
I've done the test many times, works for me! The one I just got done doing I shot a 4.600 with a 99 score, thats ten shots at 1000 yards any comments. No bull it has saved me a lot of headaches.

Joe Salt
 
Louis.J if you are talking about Degrees you would have to call Hugh Hendreckson for that. It doesen't say on the reamer. I'd take a pic. of it and show you the reamer, but I don't know how.

Joe Salt
 
Bill Whitener said:
OK JD & Greg Dennis has stated that ONLY people of known abillity should do the test. How may years have you guys shot??? I know you didn't start yesterday !!!!!!! I think he has really made a dumb statement. :mad:
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Well it wouldn't be the first time I made a dumb statement. My apologies for that. I definitely did not mean to slight anyone shooting abilities or experience.

I do not doubt the experience of Greg and JD. However I don't understand how an objective test can test 'wind sensitivity'. But I should have said, "I would like to see the actual test results of a quality shooter with a 'known' rifle with a flat crown shoot a couple of aggs in good conditions and at the range use a piloted 60 degree reamer and shoot a couple more aggs in the good conditions..."

I would like to see Jackie do it only because I am familiar with the threads he has published on these forums... how thorough and well done they have been. Not meant as a slight to Greg or JD. I worded it rather poorly. My apologies. Dennis
 
Good point Bill. I take what Mr. Sorensen says with a grain of salt. He is but one of many here that love to bash people with an opposing opinion. My test of different crowns was for my benefit and not Mr. Sorensen, If you don't like what I say, Get off your lazy ass and do your own test or shut the F%$# up, Most smart shooters would do their own test before running someone else's opinion in the ground. You and your kind are why this board has gone to the idiots. This will be my last post here. I'm tired of idiots Like Mr. Sorensen thinking they are the only ones that know anything about BR. I have been competing for 22 years and I have never seen so many pompous ass holes as I see here on BR Central.
 
JDS I think Dennis would like someone with a little more experience to do the test, I do all my own testing and what works for me I use. and yes I've had flat crowns that worked and when they were out of shape[ so to speak] I used my reamer and they shot good again, so whats your point other than to say people are Idiots. Do I shoot the lights out all the time NO but people know I'm there on occasion! This is suppose to be about Ideas that are shared with others not I'm smarter than you. When I read this tread I thought I was the only Idiot using the reamer. So know you know.

Joe Salt
 
JDS said:
Good point Bill. I take what Mr. Sorensen says with a grain of salt. He is but one of many here that love to bash people with an opposing opinion. My test of different crowns was for my benefit and not Mr. Sorensen, If you don't like what I say, Get off your lazy ass and do your own test or shut the F%$# up, Most smart shooters would do their own test before running someone else's opinion in the ground. You and your kind are why this board has gone to the idiots. This will be my last post here. I'm tired of idiots Like Mr. Sorensen thinking they are the only ones that know anything about BR. I have been competing for 22 years and I have never seen so many pompous ass holes as I see here on BR Central.
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Pleasant post JDS

I was not bashing anyone and I would not enjoy it. It isn't a matter of 'Getting off my lazy ass and doing my own test or shutting the F%$# up'... I have not competed for over 30 years and do not have the shooting skill or equipment that many who share information on this site do. I also do not feel I was running anyone's opinion in the ground. But obviously you have your perceptions.
 
JDS, it's time to back off. I've never found Dennis Sorensen (whom I don't know beyond this forum) to like bashing people. You could take his response as being a bit sensitive to being bashed himself. And he did apologize.

My opinion is that a single test with a shooter of whatever reputation, will not prove definitive. Too many variables. Mr. Boyer himself, whom I think everyone would agree can shoot, has found some barrels to be hummers -- that is, to shoot through conditions. Presumably, they do that regardless of the crown, or Mr. Boyer would have noted that, too, and not simply as a preference.

All you're ever going to get with this one will be statistical evidence. The more barrels & crowns in the sample, the closer the test results will predict a general pattern -- an SD of crown performance, if you will. Last time I looked, it took a sample size of between 50 to 75 for acceptable SD (prediction). It's not going to happen, so you all back off, please.

Charles
 
Charles I don't think Tony Boyer has too worry to much about Crowns the barrles they aren't on that long, unless he bangs one. Even then I think he would just replace it. This is for us poor folk! That is the reason I bought the reamer, if you haven't noticed gunsmith pricing, like everything else. So I think it has payed for itself!

Joe Salt
 
I think this is one of those "if it feels good and you think it helps" subjects. I believe this has been pounded into the ground many times in te past, with no definitive result as to which is better. Square/centered and burr free are the 2 biggies.
 
Dennis I really do appreciate you taking the time to address my question and I apologize for the bashing you had to take to provide me with your honest opinion.

J.Louis
 
I have no doub't that a piloted center reamer can make a very good crown. For that matter, I think that a chamfered crown
will last and tolerate brushes and rod joints longer. On the typical deer getter, I doub't that it would affect performance even
if off slightly. With that said, a center reamer is not a guarentee of perfect, especially when done by hand. We humans can
offer side forces in the best equiptment. Machinist's here all know that machine taped holes are superior to hand tapping. This is
all due to side forces. That a few people could produce a good crown with a piloted reamer doesn't mean that anyone can.
Benchrest rifles are different, We have enough variables to worry about. Its just to simple to do it right and burr free in a lathe
I have a full set of center reamers (3) that cover many calibers, but to crown this way without a lathe, one would need
8 to 10 pilots in each of all calibers. Without that array of pilots, and just a handfull of pretty close the 60 degree included
angle could become 29 degrees on one side and 31 on the other. What this comes out to is there are machinist's and there
are craftsman.
 
I've cut crowns every which way and not found any difference in any of them as long as the crown is burr free. My present method is to center the bore and to set the compound to 60 degrees. I cut the center with a Circle triangle tipped boring bar and get a crown that a cue tip doesn't shed fibers. I've tried their trigon tips and don't like them. Whether I cut a flat crown, a eleven degree crown or recessed crown on my personal benchrest rifles just depends upon the mood that I'm in at the time. The flat crown is the easiest and fastest to cut by centering the barrel and letting the cross feed feed itself out from center to outside of the barrel. If there is a difference, I'm not a good enough shooter to tell it.
 
Dennis Sorensen;
I, for one, have always found your posts to be informative and helpful. You've gone out of your way many times to describe an issue and provide helpful pictures. I think most would agree that they enjoy your posts. There are several very informative types who are willing to share beside yourself and we appreciate your input. That goes to Jackie Schmidt, Mike Bryant, alinwa, and countless others who give their experience and knowledge freely.
 
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