30br vs 6ppc?

Sorry if anyone took that seriously but it was a joke. I don't even have scope bases for my Trapdoor Springfield :cool:
 
AndyTaber said:
I shoot a 6BR in 100 yard score matches. Over the years I have closely examined my targets after a match to see what would have happened if I was shooting a 30. In the vast majority of times I might have picked up an X or two, but never enough to make a significant difference in the match outcome. I simply needed to become a better shooter because the wind was my disadvantage.

This has lead me to think perhaps the true advantage of the 30 caliber over a 6mm bullet is the weight of the bullet. Those shooting a 30 are using a bullet in the 115 gr range vs the 65 gr used by most shooting a 6. I think the heavier bullet is just less affected by the wind and that is the true advantage.
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Andy with respect, that has not been my experience.

I shoot both a 6PPC and a 30BR. I feel like I have a pretty good handle on how each reacts in various conditions.

In my experience, there is virtually no difference in the way conditions affect a 112 grn 30 caliber moving at
at 3000fps as opposed to a 68 grn Bullet moving at 3400 fps.

Randy is right. In the yardages that you can affectingly read flags, there simply isn't enough difference to make a difference. Not in BC, or anything else.

As in most BR, the best shooter with the best Rifle generally comes out on top.
 
With all due respect, Andy. Harrison is worth two or three Xs. East Tawas has gremlins in the wind. I’ve shot enough matches at the two ranges and believe me, Tawas is tough.
 
AndyTaber said:
I shoot a 6BR in 100 yard score matches. Over the years I have closely examined my targets after a match to see what would have happened if I was shooting a 30. In the vast majority of times I might have picked up an X or two, but never enough to make a significant difference in the match outcome. I simply needed to become a better shooter because the wind was my disadvantage.

This has lead me to think perhaps the true advantage of the 30 caliber over a 6mm bullet is the weight of the bullet. Those shooting a 30 are using a bullet in the 115 gr range vs the 65 gr used by most shooting a 6. I think the heavier bullet is just less affected by the wind and that is the true advantage.
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Andy,
with all due respect, I don't know how well you shoot or your competition. That being said, I can tell you and probably show you some of the results the results and targets, if I picked up a couple of X's in every match, what I said above would be absolutely true. You give me an extra .0325 and more often than not, I'll beat you.

Rick
 
FBecigneul said:
With all due respect, Andy. Harrison is worth two or three Xs. East Tawas has gremlins in the wind. I’ve shot enough matches at the two ranges and believe me, Tawas is tough.
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Francis,
there aren't any easy ranges, just bad days and worse.

Rick
 
Greyfox said:
Andy,
with all due respect, I don't know how well you shoot or your competition. That being said, I can tell you and probably show you some of the results the results and targets, if I picked up a couple of X's in every match, what I said above would be absolutely true. You give me an extra .0325 and more often than not, I'll beat you.

Rick
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I am still a relatively new shooter, only been at this about 8 years. I won a match here at Tawas a few years back and a couple of third place finishes at Harrison. One thing I can say for sure there is a long line of shooters out there that can beat me, but I’m hanging in there.
 
I have seen these discussions where the 30BR and 6PPC are compared in score shooting and have stayed away from them except for one time I did give an opinion- and when I did my comment was ignored so I'll try this again. These discussions only compare bullet diameter and wind. There is more involved- and it is recoil, anyone that has ever shot both 30's and 6's know that the recoil and gun movement on a 30 is much more than a 6MM (even in a 13 1/2 pound rifle) and recoil is a big disadvantage where accuracy is involved. When considering recoil I truly do not think the 30 has an advantage in IBS and NBRSA score matches and think the smaller calibers should have an advantage in UBR matches.

Wayne Corley
 
brcman said:
I have seen these discussions where the 30BR and 6PPC are compared in score shooting and have stayed away from them except for one time I did give an opinion- and when I did my comment was ignored so I'll try this again. These discussions only compare bullet diameter and wind. There is more involved- and it is recoil, anyone that has ever shot both 30's and 6's know that the recoil and gun movement on a 30 is much more than a 6MM (even in a 13 1/2 pound rifle) and recoil is a big disadvantage where accuracy is involved. When considering recoil I truly do not think the 30 has an advantage in IBS and NBRSA score matches and think the smaller calibers should have an advantage in UBR matches.

Wayne Corley
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Recoil is more noticeable in a 30. You get used to it.
 
brcman said:
I have seen these discussions where the 30BR and 6PPC are compared in score shooting and have stayed away from them except for one time I did give an opinion- and when I did my comment was ignored so I'll try this again. These discussions only compare bullet diameter and wind. There is more involved- and it is recoil, anyone that has ever shot both 30's and 6's know that the recoil and gun movement on a 30 is much more than a 6MM (even in a 13 1/2 pound rifle) and recoil is a big disadvantage where accuracy is involved. When considering recoil I truly do not think the 30 has an advantage in IBS and NBRSA score matches and think the smaller calibers should have an advantage in UBR matches.

Wayne Corley
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I shot a 30BR for the first 6-8 years in score shooting when I was competing in IBS matches. As Jackie says, it is noticeable but you do get used to it. Something else to consider is that unlike group shooting, you aren't returning to the same aim point. Every shot is different so the return and proper handlin while important isn't quite the same. Jimy Campbell who shot with us for years was fond of saying that group shooting was easier because you get the first shot free. More than once I've seen one regular shoot a sighter and five record shots on an IBS target in less than 12 seconds and get all the X's. The recoil didn't bother him. I don't know that the smaller calibers have an advantage in UBR matches, but I would be the first to say that they are much more pleasant to shoot.

Rick
 
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If one looks at the results

of last years UBR Nationals one can see a story there. Looks to me like there may be a real advantage to shooting 6MM's, at least in their game.

Pete
 
jackie schmidt said:
In my experience, there is virtually no difference in the way conditions affect a 112 grn 30 caliber moving at
at 3000fps as opposed to a 68 grn Bullet moving at 3400 fps.
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Berger has revised their BC's. They currently spec the 6mm 68gr flat base at a G1 of .255, and they spec their 30 cal. 115gr flat base at a G1 of .289. If we fire the 6mm bullet at 3400 fps, we get 4.11" of drift at 200 yards. If we fire the 30 cal. at 3030 fps, we get 4.11" of drift at 200 yards. When Jackie says he can't see a difference in wind drift, believe him.

Michael
 
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Im not sure what the recoil of a 30br would be like but im assuming it will be less than my f/tr 308 shooting 185gr bullets. My rifle even weighs less than 13&1/2 pounds . Our club matches also dont have a weight limit.
 
TrxR said:
Im not sure what the recoil of a 30br would be like but im assuming it will be less than my f/tr 308 shooting 185gr bullets. My rifle even weighs less than 13&1/2 pounds . Our club matches also dont have a weight limit.
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Noticeably much less, comparing a 118 to a 185gr bullet. If you start competing with a 30 BR you may find it difficult to go back to a .308 and a 185.

Rick
 
sorry pete we are talking br group and score not silly games.

Pete Wass said:
of last years UBR Nationals one can see a story there. Looks to me like there may be a real advantage to shooting 6MM's, at least in their game.

Pete
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Mark Twain as read by him in the New York Journal

"The reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated"
 
Well,

retired said:
sorry pete we are talking br group and score not silly games

Interesting observation but if there is no difference between 6 MM and 30 Cal. in accuracy, be it group or games then what is one to glean from those results?

Pete
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