.22-.100 ppc

B

ballpowder

Member
Ok, I have brass formed with Lambert bushing form dies and fireformed. My question is, what is a common die set up? I think a ss Wilson set shortened would work. Maybe a redding body bump die?? Actually have trouble getting machinists to do work out of their "comfort zone" in my town. If my idea is correct please suggest someone to do work. If not I would appreciate getting pointed in the right direction. Thanks


Tim J.
 
Thanks

Ok, and you guys have been satisfied with neck tension? I guess I will send my reamer print to Harrel. Thanks. Dave how is the HVACR buisness in your area? In S.E. Alaska here we had a little scare but coming back. I thought I was going to have to lay a few off around X-mas but got lucky.

Tim J.
 
Commerical HVAC

I closed last May after 27 years. Primarly I build shcools, mecal building and multi story office complexs. If I'd been a smarter business man I'd of quit earlier but I had 40 guys with families depending on me.
 
Harrells can do it, or Neil Jones. You may want to check with Harrells, they may want three fired cases sent to them as Jones does. With Jones, he likes the cases to be fired multiple times to ensure a good shape of the chamber. The wilson type seater is fine though, provided it is cut to fit your chamber. Wilson does make Custom dies, just call.

Paul
 
The best way to...

push the shoulder back on the new cases is with a shortened 22-250 FL die, RCBS or Hornady or whatever. I've used one a lot that Dwight Scott made for me years ago.

When reloading .002" neck tension works for this cartridge.

I have found that it takes three firings to get new cases really straight.

The best FL die I've ever had for sizing competition cases was from Neil Jones.

Body to neck run out on fired brass (after it has had the initial three firings) should be no more than .0002" to .0003". If it's more than that, you need my gunsmith.

Body to neck run out on FL sized brass should be under .0005".

The above based on shooting the .22 PPC -.100 short a LOT since early 2001.

I wrote long articles about case prep and reloading for the cartridge for Precision Shooting in 2001 and, again, sometime around 2004.

Dick Wright
 
Hmmm??

Is it actually BAD to use dies other than 22-250 for forming? I was finally was able to reach Lynwood and he does want fired cases even though I have reamer and its drawings.
My next question is where to begin with charges. I believe that I read that the 22 PPC short is the same as .223 rem. True or false?
Dick, I appreciate your wisdom and would love to get a hold of the articles, but how? Is there a way P.S. magazine office could send me a back issue from a description over the phone? Hope so.
I have been experimenting with 270 win cases formed into 22 br to reduce capacity. 28gr. of varget flattens primers but shoots fairly well. Going to work my way back down again, maybe find a load that is better. If I was smart I would stop screwing around with 22's and sharpen up on just shootin' my 6ppc.


Some fools never learn! Thanks everyone, Tim J.
 
Precision Shooting probably...

has the back issues and they will sell them to you.

Call the office (860-645-8776) during business hours and give them this information. They should be able to identify the issues. As I recall there was a series of four articles in 2001 when I got my Scott-Scoville-Hall chambered for the .22 Short. One of the articles was exclusively devoted to making the brass and loading same. I called the gun "The Snake Gun" because of the carbon fiber stock and that should be in the titles of the articles.

The other series was when I got the Kelbly Stolle Griz II, again in the same cartridge.

That is an extremely accurate case. The Super Shoot has been won twice with it since 1999 in spite of the fact that a very small percentage of the shooters use it.

Dick
 
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Twist

I spoke with Jim Carmichael at the Super Shoot regarding the 22 cheetah. He made the comment that he had best results with 16 1/2" twist. Made me wonder if 55gr.ers could remain stable out to 400 yds in a slow twist like that then maybe speedy little rounds would benefit from a 15" at 100/200? Granted we are not sending them out at 4100 ft/sec. My barrel is a barely used 14" Olewine that came with Bill Reiter's old rifle. Bill said it shot O.K. as a full 22 ppc.
Somebody out there must have tried a 15? Dick, what about you?



Tim Jurczak
 
waldog

Skeetlee, Yes they are within .025 of each other. Do you have experience with the waldog? Original question was about dies but, all info is useful.

Tim J.
 
I had one 15" twist...

barrel for one of my guns. George Kelbly Sr. suggested that I try one. It didn't work as well for me as the 14" twist but George was shooting hotter than I was so my results were predictable.

I found that 3490 fps worked very well for me. I could get up to 3540 but when the temperatures warmed up it got too hot. George used different cartridges then I did and shot faster so, I have no doubt, the 15" was better for him.

If, as your name implies, you like ball powder, I suggest that you try some none ball powder in this cartridge. I had some ball at one Nationals years ago and made a complete arse of myself when the temps got up to around 100 deg. and the humidity was very high. Mike Ratigan has won the Super Shoot and a couple of world championships with this cartridge and fast lots of 133.

Dick
 
BLC powder works well in the .100 short case. However, trying to find BLC powder is just about the same as trying to find T32. BLC2 and BLC are not the same. Some of the BLC powder that I have is marked with a 1965 date. That means that Hodgdon packaged it for resale in 1965. That doesn't mean that it was made then. There's no telling how old that powder actually is.
 
The short 22 ppc really has my attention and i even ran across a nice used barrel but i feel like i need to stick with the 6ppc for this year. I have a lot to learn about this short game and i need to focus on one thing at a time. I really like the hole idea behind it though and i will eventually have a barrel chambered for the .100 22ppc. It makes since to me. I am an old shot-gunner of many years and the recoil i experienced while shooting 500 + rounds a week has me a bit gunny. I even had to shoot release triggers in all mu shotguns because of the recoil. The 6ppc isn't really a heavy recoiling rifle but that little 22 cal 52gr bullet sure would be nice, not to mention the grouping calculations benefit behind it has. Thanks Lee
 
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Some misunderstanding

"not to mention the grouping calculations benefit behind it has."

Contary to score shooting where the biggest bullet diameter has benefit compared to smaller bullet diameter (.30 cal versus 6mm or .224 ) there is no advantage of small bullet diameter .224 versus .30cal when calculating group size.

The size of a group is the total outside diameter of the group with subtraction of the bullet diameter, regardless of what it is. By that any difference in bullet diameter is out of the equation.

Another way to put it; a group is measured center to center of the outmost bullets so bullet diameter does not matter. The bullets diameter is mesured first in the total overall measurement and then subtracted just for eace of measuring as it is impossible to measure from the imaginary center of a bullet hole.

Bergur
 
SGJennings said:
I understand the drive-ability of the 22, but someone is going to have to explain the "grouping calculations benefit" to me.
Click to expand...

Measuring at a benchrest match is done with the correct sized scoring ring for the bullet size used. A group shot with a .22 is measured with a .22 diameter scoring ring. A 6 mm is scored with a .24 sized scoring ring. The only way I can see any scoring benefit would be if the scorer makes a mistake on measuring and uses a 6mm ring instead of the .22 ring that should be used which could make the group measure slightly smaller than it should. Even then it's supposed to be that the scoring ring is centered on the each of the farthest two bullets which isn't that hard to do when there are two distinct widest bullet holes. It gets harder the smaller the group. Then the group could measure smaller if the wrong sized scoring ring is used. But, it's scorer error and not an inherent scoring difference between a .22 and a 6mm.
 
There is one thing I've noticed when shooting a .22 as opposed to a 6mm. You can shoot a round hole with a 6mm and can have a pretty large group. If you shoot a round hole with a .22, it will be a small group. A group in the .2's when shot with a .22 won't be round in overall appearance.
 
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