sizing dies

[g n brezinski]

how does a custom die differ from a factory die.can you give examples as far as the dimentions of said dies.have a factory die in 6mm ppc and dies in 6mm br both full length types.one is a readig the other a bannansia.also have a harrell custom in the 22 br.looking to get a harrell in the 6 mm ppc in the spring.
gary b

 

[rsmithsr]

the custom can be very close to your chamber, based on fired cases.
most production is based on saami.
redding can get very close on a 30 br so a 6br also.
my 6 dasher is a redding also

 

[Boyd Allen]

Harrells uses CNC turning equipment and boring bars to produce the interior shapes of their dies. The reason that they have such quick turn arounds is that they make standard versions that mostly vary by base opening diameter that they have sitting on the shelf when your order comes in. They look at your instructions, gauge your fired brass and select the die that is correct for your chamber. If you get the die and find that you want more or less sizing, I believe that they will swap to get you where you want to be. I believe that the same sort of equipment is used by the Hornady custom shop with the exception that all of their dies are made to order. Friends have told me that they are pleased with their custom dies. I have seen the Harrell's dies in great numbers at benchrest matches, so they must be doing something right.

 

[g n brezinski]

dies

on an average howmuch do the custom dies reduce the fired case ,say .002 all over or just at certain places on case sy at neck ad bace at the datum area.

 

[Al Nyhus]

on an average how much do the custom dies reduce the fired case, say .002 all over or just at certain places on case say at neck ad back at the datum area.

Being a 'custom' die, it's however much you ask the die maker to provide.

In general, .002 at shoulder/body junction and @ .200 ahead of the extractor groove from a fired case is a pretty good place to start for a case length in the 1.500-1.875 range.

Harrel's offers a good selection of dies based on your fired cases. I have found that if a #2 die (for example) is specd. by them, a #2.5, and more likely a #3, actually works better.

FWIW...Just what seems to work on this end.

Good shootin'. -Al

 

[Pete Wass]

I agree

Being a 'custom' die, it's however much you ask the die maker to provide.

In general, .002 at shoulder/body junction and @ .200 ahead of the extractor groove from a fired case is a pretty good place to start for a case length in the 1.500-1.875 range.

Harrel's offers a good selection of dies based on your fired cases. I have found that if a #2 die (for example) is specd. by them, a #2.5, and more likely a #3, actually works better.

FWIW...Just what seems to work on this end.

Good shootin'. -Al

If I ever bought anther Harrell die it would be a #3. I have two of them and both are too small, particularly once cases have been fired a lot. When the bttom of the cases get real hard, a #4 wouldn't be to tight because the spring back gets worse.



Pete

 

[Al Nyhus]

When the bttom of the cases get real hard, a #4 wouldn't be to tight because the spring back gets worse. Pete

Pete, when the back end of a 308-family case gets that tight, a pass through a 45ACP carbide die can work wonders.

Good shootin'. -Al

 

[mwezell]

I use a die reamer that is .003" smaller than the chamber reamer. This yields a sized piece of brass that's about .0015 smaller at the shoulder and .0005-.0006 smaller at the web, opposed to a fire and unsized case.

Absolutely nothing wrong with custom dies but I get to the same point by spec'ing my chamber reamers .003" larger than the die/reamer. This is where someone like Kiff is an invaluable resource of knowledge, as he makes a big portion of the reamers used by Redding, Hornady and others to make their dies. Hence, he knows the reamer specs that they use to make the dies.

The whole idea here is to yield brass that is sized the same as a custom die will size it for a given chamber. It just makes things simple to buy a reamer that gives a chamber that works well with an off the shelf die, such as a Redding bushing die. I don't consider one way or the other to be better than the other, except that I don't have to buy custom dies doing it this way.

The attributes of a custom can be debated till the cows come home but a sizing die has a very simple job to do. If it's sized properly IN RELATION TO THE CHAMBER, I find that the off the shelf dies do this very well. Most runout issues come from excessive sizing, IME, not crooked dies. A die can be perfect before heat treat but warp and change dimensions afterward. This applies to all of them, custom or not.

I've been aiming to try a melonited die to see how it works, but primarily, to see how it holds dimensions compared to a more typical heat treat methods.

 

[rkittine]

All the dies for my precision rifles are custom made Whidden ones. I sent 5, three times fired (with only neck sizing) cases to Whidden and they made the dies. For rifles that I do not own my own reamers for, I have not done that since, the next barrel and chamber job may be different then the last one, hence a need for a new sizing die. Interesting enough though, when Harley Baker and I were going to get together and do some reloading, he told me just to get the Redding Narrow Base 6PPC die, which I did, though we have not been able to match up schedules and weather to meet up, especially now due to COVID.

Bob

 

[tim]

A custom die can be nice in a couple regards. Most of them will incorporate a bushing to size necks in accordance to your neck, turning thickness, and tension requirements. After that, in a true BR environment, if cut based off your chamber, it will allow a bump of the shoulder of , say, .001”-.002” to allow proper, easy, chambering and modest sizing of the base of the case giving proper fit but eliminating a harder “ click” on final bolt lift that can occur with some actions, leaving the rest of case unsized.
While gunsmiths often are not enthusiastic about supplying custom FL dies, and as stated others work reasonably well, as you invest in guns, gear, etc., it is great to have your own reamer and a matched FL die for same.
I have four different platforms and several barrels and while I don’t, I can put any case in any barrel to shoot with no more than maybe a click or so on my die adjuster so I don’t have to reinvent the wheel all the time. Not a bad backup plan.