Savage Palma Rifle

J

jim

Member
I just finished shooting my Savage Palma rifle in 308 today and it really seems like it's going to be a shooter. I was shooting some Speer 125 TNT's to break in the barrel and they shot extremely well. This evening I loaded up some Berger 155's combined with Varget to see how they shoot tomorrow. I used a Sinclair gauge to determine the OAL with the Berger
155's and it resulted in an OAL of 2.81 (just off the lands). When I chambered a round tonight the bolt was extremely hard to close although when I measured the round after I removed it it still measured exactly the same.

Any ideas on what's going on?

Thanks
 
Sounds like your seating depth is jamming the bullet hard into the lands. With a loupe, you can probably see the marks of the lands on the bullet. If not, investigate until you determine the cause -- case is a bit too long, or something's really crooked -- what ever is taking the camming work of the bolt and still causing "hard closing."

Most of us who shoot benchrest don't use loaded round OAL. We talk about "bullet jam," or "bullet jump." To determine this is simple in concept, but the first time, can take a while. I think the first time took about an hour. Now it takes me about 5 minutes.

Size a case so the bullet is a tight slip fit -- e.g., you can seat the bullet in a Wilson seater using thumb pressure. No powder or primer, of course. Then polish the bullet with 0000 Steel Wool, or better, Scotch Brite. This is the one time you measure the OAL (to make sure the bullet doesn't move as you chamber and extract it). Chamber it, and extract it. Measure it to make sure the bullet hasn't moved. Now use a loupe to look at the bullet. At some seating depth, you'll see the beginnings of the lands marking the bullet. Just how much isn't too important, it can vary a few thousandths from shooter to shooter. Every land should make a slight line, or mark.

Call this point "just touching." It can make for shooting very small groups, but is also usually fickle. Best is to test at your "just touching," at .005 deeper, and at .010 deeper. (edit: deeper here means farther into the lands - i.e., the marks on the bullet will be longer.) Then try .005 off, and .020 off. If .020 off is best, try as much as .040 off. ("off" means "off the lands" -- no marks at all.) The measurements refer to the seating stem, not the marks on the bullet. If you use a threaded die in a press, figure out the advancement with the threads. If .020 was best and .040 worse, try .030. I only work in .005 increments around the "just touching" point, and .010 as you move away from it. Others mileage may vary.

I test with 4-shot groups, though 3-shot groups are enough to rule out a "worse" depth. The extra shots won't make the group any smaller. Use the smallest number of shots where you're confident of you shooting skill -- 5-shot groups come only to confirm, when you think you're on to something.

In other words, dial in seating depth for the best performance for that bullet in that barrel. It will probably remain constant the life of the barrel -- i.e., you'll have to chase the throat as it erodes -- but every once in a while, a barrel with shoot better making no change, even as the throat erodes. I have no idea why this happens.

Hope this helps.
 
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Like he said but with the quote from my father "better to start your load short of the groves to keep the pressure down" you can always work up to the lands and keep safe at the same time.

Keep us informed on the Savage Palma rifle, was thinking of one myself (like I need another) for an F/TR Rifle (don't care for the stock on the Savage F-Class guns) to replace the aging Savage Palma
112BTS I use now. They made a heck of a rifle in their day, the first out of the box center fire rifle I could mount a rear target sight & slide a front siight on the barrel, wound up with all 3 they made, 223 Rem, .308 Win, & the single shot 300 Win Mag.
 
Taildrag15X said:
"better to start your load short of the groves to keep the pressure down" you can always work up to the lands and keep safe at the same time.
Click to expand...
Sure. But human nature being what it is, I'd argue this is actually more dangerous. You're jumping the bullet .040. Everything looks fine pressure wise. Hmm. Let's see if jumping less or jamming will shoot smaller. Change the seating die, ready to go.

Did you remember to drop the charge weight?

Better to work up to max pressure with a jammed bullet. That way, any changes you make will result in less pressure. If you forget to change the charge, you're safe.
 
Jim its gotta be the case cause the bullet would not cause large amounts of resistance to bolt closure. I shot palma for 12 years and found that the 308 shot better soft seated, this is when the neck tension is reduced to about .0006 or so and the bullet is seated LONG by about 20 over a jam and let the chamber seat that bullet, that way you get a seated round that are ALL the SAME. Do look at your sizing and fix the case tightness causing the hard bolt closure. Be safe
Clarence
 
Depends on which Berger 155's the OP is using... for the B155VLD I used to seat +10 past a hard jam with just enough neck tension that I didn't have to worry much about ejecting a loaded round and leaving the bullet behind, so it was definitely finding its own happy place in the throat ;) For the B155.5BT 'Fullbore' I've been having great results in both my 12 F/TR and 12 Palma running it about 45 thou off the lands. At that point... if it's 44 or 47, it really doesn't matter when the bullet is jumping that much to begin with. Still managed to find the X-ring fairly regularly...
 
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