G
GStick
Guest
Are ALL of the Remington 40-X, centerfire models trued/squared/blueprinted (whatever the proper terminology is) at the factory or Custom shop ? Or are the single shot 40-XBR (Benchrest series) models the only ones ?
J
Jkob
Guest
In my experience working with the 40x's, I have found that some are less true than the standard 700, meaning more runout.
Bob Kingsbury
New member
40x rem actions are not trued at the factory, singleshot or repeater.
They are within factory tollerance. For whatever thats worth.
They are within factory tollerance. For whatever thats worth.
jackie schmidt
New member
GStick
The only difference in a 40x action and a standard 700 Short Action (mechanical wise), is the 40X does not have the magazine cut away.
Your next question is probably, "then why do they cost so much". Simple. You are paying for a name. It does, after all, have "40X" stamped on the side of the action.
I suspect when the local 40X cult members read this, the battle of words will begin. It's only been about a month since the last "hash and bash of the 40X" took place.
Most of the 40X's popularity centers around investment value, not shooting. It's almost like a bunch of shooters are buying and selling these things among each other, hoping for the occasional ignorant, and gullible, shooter to happen along and sip the cool aid, and open the check book..........jackie
The only difference in a 40x action and a standard 700 Short Action (mechanical wise), is the 40X does not have the magazine cut away.
Your next question is probably, "then why do they cost so much". Simple. You are paying for a name. It does, after all, have "40X" stamped on the side of the action.
I suspect when the local 40X cult members read this, the battle of words will begin. It's only been about a month since the last "hash and bash of the 40X" took place.
Most of the 40X's popularity centers around investment value, not shooting. It's almost like a bunch of shooters are buying and selling these things among each other, hoping for the occasional ignorant, and gullible, shooter to happen along and sip the cool aid, and open the check book..........jackie
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G
GStick
Guest
Very interesting. On "Big Greens" website, under Custom Shop, it says that the 40-X models are blueprinted. Also, the 40-XBR doesn't have Remington 40-XBR "STAMPED", it is etched on the action, so as not to stress the action. This is all what I found out today by searching, so I don't know if any of it is true. Thank You all for the responses!
jackie schmidt
New member
Stick
Maybe "BIG GREENS" of definition of truing an action is a tad different than what most precision Gunsmiths believe.
All I can tell you is this. I have trued five 40x actions. They dated from early 80's to late 90's. None were any truer than a typical 700 out of the box.
I think any competent Craftsman will tell you the same thing.
Keep in mind, Remington also sells the 40x as a "Benchrest" Rifle. I guess that is true, just not a very good one..........jackie
Maybe "BIG GREENS" of definition of truing an action is a tad different than what most precision Gunsmiths believe.
All I can tell you is this. I have trued five 40x actions. They dated from early 80's to late 90's. None were any truer than a typical 700 out of the box.
I think any competent Craftsman will tell you the same thing.
Keep in mind, Remington also sells the 40x as a "Benchrest" Rifle. I guess that is true, just not a very good one..........jackie
Bob Kingsbury
New member
I just completed a 40x rebuild. It was etched and although we would like
to believe this was done to eliminate stress, it definitely did away
with a stamping machine( money saved). The bolt fit was very admireable
about .002 verticle play at the rear bridge. The face of the action still
was off as were the threads. The face showing the common non
concentric pattern. It may have been better than some, but not
blue print as we know it.
to believe this was done to eliminate stress, it definitely did away
with a stamping machine( money saved). The bolt fit was very admireable
about .002 verticle play at the rear bridge. The face of the action still
was off as were the threads. The face showing the common non
concentric pattern. It may have been better than some, but not
blue print as we know it.
O
Octopus
Guest
The truth about 40X Rifles
Well I am one of the occasional ignorant, and gullible, shooter to happen along and sip the cool aid, and open the check book. Back in August 2000 I became the proud owner of a Rem 40X. I picked it up second hand but it was as new still in the box with the factory target. Did not appear to ever have been shot.
As for the factory custom shop quality on this rifle: It sucked!
The recoil lug was on backwards. The recoil lug was bedded with a dab of gel compound on one edge only. The scope base holes in the top of the receiver were were not true to the bore. OFF A LOT! And the trigger was no good. Off a concrete table the rifle would shoot about 3/4 Mil at best.
After a new trigger, pillow block bedding and so on for 30+ manhours I had a 40X that would shoot aggs under 0.250.
My 40X has been my best rifle. I have more fun with it than any other rifle I own! (I have a 10.5# Panda from Jim Boden. It is not much fun as it will always shoot near perfect if I do my part. It is perfect, nothing to do by shoot it.) The 40X is different. Always there is an opportunity to make a new financial investment as something else is always needed. For example I now have three stocks, two bolts, several scopes and a dozen or more barrels. My 40X shoots everything from 222 to 6.5X284. And my total investment is not much over $10,000.
You can always go to BR gunsmith and have a custom action BR rifle built for a few thousand dollars and go shoot perfect. But when you buy a 40X you always have an improvement project waiting to be started. There is always work to be done. When the new Brownell and Midway catalogs come it you can usually find new things to order.
If you like to work on rifles, and spend money, the 40X is the way to go. You can do the same with a 700 but it is not as elite.
What we need is for someone to make some 40X hats and tee shirts.
Well I am one of the occasional ignorant, and gullible, shooter to happen along and sip the cool aid, and open the check book. Back in August 2000 I became the proud owner of a Rem 40X. I picked it up second hand but it was as new still in the box with the factory target. Did not appear to ever have been shot.
As for the factory custom shop quality on this rifle: It sucked!
The recoil lug was on backwards. The recoil lug was bedded with a dab of gel compound on one edge only. The scope base holes in the top of the receiver were were not true to the bore. OFF A LOT! And the trigger was no good. Off a concrete table the rifle would shoot about 3/4 Mil at best.
After a new trigger, pillow block bedding and so on for 30+ manhours I had a 40X that would shoot aggs under 0.250.
My 40X has been my best rifle. I have more fun with it than any other rifle I own! (I have a 10.5# Panda from Jim Boden. It is not much fun as it will always shoot near perfect if I do my part. It is perfect, nothing to do by shoot it.) The 40X is different. Always there is an opportunity to make a new financial investment as something else is always needed. For example I now have three stocks, two bolts, several scopes and a dozen or more barrels. My 40X shoots everything from 222 to 6.5X284. And my total investment is not much over $10,000.
You can always go to BR gunsmith and have a custom action BR rifle built for a few thousand dollars and go shoot perfect. But when you buy a 40X you always have an improvement project waiting to be started. There is always work to be done. When the new Brownell and Midway catalogs come it you can usually find new things to order.
If you like to work on rifles, and spend money, the 40X is the way to go. You can do the same with a 700 but it is not as elite.
What we need is for someone to make some 40X hats and tee shirts.
Bob Kingsbury
New member
octopus
I find it interesting that your recoil lug was on backwards. I have a
box of them, probably 40-50. Let me be the first to tell you
there is no difference between the front and back.
I find it interesting that your recoil lug was on backwards. I have a
box of them, probably 40-50. Let me be the first to tell you
there is no difference between the front and back.
brian roberts
New member
Except, perhaps the direction............
they were blanked from..........??
they were blanked from..........??
Bob Kingsbury
New member
Lugs
Rem lugs certainly are blanked, and therefore have a direction. They
are however cleaned up in some finishing process, which leaves no
trailing edges. I have some aftermarket lugs which are no flatter . That
a gun will shoot better having the lug turned around is subject to my B.S.
sniffer and fails
Rem lugs certainly are blanked, and therefore have a direction. They
are however cleaned up in some finishing process, which leaves no
trailing edges. I have some aftermarket lugs which are no flatter . That
a gun will shoot better having the lug turned around is subject to my B.S.
sniffer and fails
Boyd Allen
Active member
The etched ones are the 40XB-BRs. The reason that they are not stamped is that the OD is ground after hardening so that the bottom 180 degrees of the action would be a true cylinder. Factory testing showed that it mattered for accuracy, and the stamping, that had to be done pre-hardening would take too much hand work to fix if the OD was ground after stamping...at least that was what I was told was the practice, back when Mike Walker ran the custom shop. Several years ago, after the move to the sun belt, I called the the custom shop, and spoke to the man in charge, asking whether the 40XB-BRs were still made the same way. He had no idea what I was talking about.
Groan!
The only thing difference between the run of the mill Remingtons and what comes out of the Custom Shop is "spit polish".
Same barrels, same actions (yes I know the the 40X action is not cut out) therefore should be less money=
Ask someone you trust, that has been in the Custom Shop and ask them how many machines were set up for truing actions or cutting chambers. ZERO or 0?
Remington is no longer the Remington that was known when Mr Walker ran the show................................................................................................
The only thing difference between the run of the mill Remingtons and what comes out of the Custom Shop is "spit polish".
Same barrels, same actions (yes I know the the 40X action is not cut out) therefore should be less money
=Ask someone you trust, that has been in the Custom Shop and ask them how many machines were set up for truing actions or cutting chambers. ZERO or 0?
Remington is no longer the Remington that was known when Mr Walker ran the show................................................................................................
Bob Kingsbury
New member
40x, new and old
In the mid 70's , custom actions were not real common on the fireing
line as they are today. Stuart Ottesens book focuses on stiffness as
that was the primary concern. Had this forum existed then, discussions
about trueing actions probably would not have been commonplace.The
clearance in bolt to action fit was seen as better than a mauser and
therefore pretty good. My point here is that the remington 40x has really
not changed very much. In comparison, custom built rifles are much better
today and carry a bigger tag. I tried to purchase a 40x from rem. in the
late 70's. Given a delivery date of over a year, I declined, but was able
to buy direct from them, a 40x barreled action in two weeks. The stock
also 40xb-br was purchased from the parts dept. I shot that gun
at what was then Harts range in nescopeck, next to Pat McMillian.
I of course did not shoot well as my understanding of conditions was
poor. Weighing in my novice approach to the wind, Pat did tell me that
my 222 40X was about as accurate a gun as he had ever seen. That
action is still in use now and shoots quite well. When I bought that
barreled action, with a rem 2 oz trigger, the price was $365. Today
it would be over 3 times that, and not the best deal around. I see no
difference in newer 40X actions, but the economics are much different.
In the mid 70's , custom actions were not real common on the fireing
line as they are today. Stuart Ottesens book focuses on stiffness as
that was the primary concern. Had this forum existed then, discussions
about trueing actions probably would not have been commonplace.The
clearance in bolt to action fit was seen as better than a mauser and
therefore pretty good. My point here is that the remington 40x has really
not changed very much. In comparison, custom built rifles are much better
today and carry a bigger tag. I tried to purchase a 40x from rem. in the
late 70's. Given a delivery date of over a year, I declined, but was able
to buy direct from them, a 40x barreled action in two weeks. The stock
also 40xb-br was purchased from the parts dept. I shot that gun
at what was then Harts range in nescopeck, next to Pat McMillian.
I of course did not shoot well as my understanding of conditions was
poor. Weighing in my novice approach to the wind, Pat did tell me that
my 222 40X was about as accurate a gun as he had ever seen. That
action is still in use now and shoots quite well. When I bought that
barreled action, with a rem 2 oz trigger, the price was $365. Today
it would be over 3 times that, and not the best deal around. I see no
difference in newer 40X actions, but the economics are much different.
D
Del Martin
Guest
40xbr
Are any of the 40X series as accurate as a custom bench gun? NO
Are they worth going to all the expense to make them BR competitive? NO
Will a 6X47 compete with a 6 PPC? NO
Are the a pleasure to shoot and own a bit of history? Yes
Here is one re-chambered by Nelson Berger in 22 PPC. It will not out shoot any of my benchrest rifles but I'll never sell it because I love it. There is just no accounting for some peoples taste.
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r283/40X/40XBR.jpg
Are any of the 40X series as accurate as a custom bench gun? NO
Are they worth going to all the expense to make them BR competitive? NO
Will a 6X47 compete with a 6 PPC? NO
Are the a pleasure to shoot and own a bit of history? Yes
Here is one re-chambered by Nelson Berger in 22 PPC. It will not out shoot any of my benchrest rifles but I'll never sell it because I love it. There is just no accounting for some peoples taste.
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r283/40X/40XBR.jpg
G
GStick
Guest
Can a Remington 40-X or a model 700 (for that matter) be competitive (after proper truing by a proffessional riflesmith) at the 600 and 1000 yard disciplines ? You better believe it !
G
Gerry
Guest
Rem 40X
I never sold them short.
I have one that i bought new in 72.
It was a 40Xbr stainless barrel 2 oz trigger.
The price was whooping $400 at the time.
It had two test target with loads, the caliber was 6x/47 remington.
The was a nice .250 group with IMR 4895 and a 60 sierra.
The second was smaller with 26.3 of Hodgdons 4895 and the same sierra.
I had nothing to complain about .
The targets were fired in a test tunnel with standard brass.
I used the loads for quite a while, but neck turning the brass and it shot
Even better.
The Rifle at that time WAS HIGHLY ACCURATE Warren pages book talked about it in detail AKA the 1/4 minute Rifle/
I think that's what's laking today a Factory rifle that will keep up with
The custom ones of today. The only other ones at the time had to be
Built by a smith.
Givin the times i would do it again.
I never sold them short.
I have one that i bought new in 72.
It was a 40Xbr stainless barrel 2 oz trigger.
The price was whooping $400 at the time.
It had two test target with loads, the caliber was 6x/47 remington.
The was a nice .250 group with IMR 4895 and a 60 sierra.
The second was smaller with 26.3 of Hodgdons 4895 and the same sierra.
I had nothing to complain about .
The targets were fired in a test tunnel with standard brass.
I used the loads for quite a while, but neck turning the brass and it shot
Even better.
The Rifle at that time WAS HIGHLY ACCURATE Warren pages book talked about it in detail AKA the 1/4 minute Rifle/
I think that's what's laking today a Factory rifle that will keep up with
The custom ones of today. The only other ones at the time had to be
Built by a smith.
Givin the times i would do it again.
Boyd Allen
Active member
John,
I did not mean to suggest that 40Xs are any better than they have been described, just that there are probably differences depending on when they were made and what version. Indeed, my last sentence was meant to say exactly what yours did. I was just relaying a little history. If I was building a fine varmint rifle, I would much rather use one of the Remington clones, much more economical than paying a premium for a 40X and having it trued, and tightened. Friends have rifles based on Stiller's, and they are very happy with how they shoot.
Boyd
I did not mean to suggest that 40Xs are any better than they have been described, just that there are probably differences depending on when they were made and what version. Indeed, my last sentence was meant to say exactly what yours did. I was just relaying a little history. If I was building a fine varmint rifle, I would much rather use one of the Remington clones, much more economical than paying a premium for a 40X and having it trued, and tightened. Friends have rifles based on Stiller's, and they are very happy with how they shoot.
Boyd
4
40EZXS
Guest
40X Build Pure American
The 40X is kinda like a cult. I have a RF...yes,I know.I got just the receiver from Gene Davis a BR RF smith of some fame. PT&G,bolt a Hall Firing Pin and a Kelly trigger....I'm from Ohio. Lilja barrel.Even a new bolt handle and knob.
Gene told me it was made while Mike Walker ran the custom shop.This seems to be the mark,when Mike Walker ran the "Shop".
After Gene did his magic...it is a range buster.
Again,it is a cult thing....pure american.
The 40X is kinda like a cult. I have a RF...yes,I know.I got just the receiver from Gene Davis a BR RF smith of some fame. PT&G,bolt a Hall Firing Pin and a Kelly trigger....I'm from Ohio. Lilja barrel.Even a new bolt handle and knob.
Gene told me it was made while Mike Walker ran the custom shop.This seems to be the mark,when Mike Walker ran the "Shop".
After Gene did his magic...it is a range buster.
Again,it is a cult thing....pure american.