Question for those who have collected on claims with the USPS?

VaniB

New member
When claiming a loss for a package, will USPS refund any or all of your cost for shipping charges?

For an example; Let's say you ship a rifle worth $900, and let's say that you pay them $68 for shipping and insurance coverage. Of that $68, $48 is the shipping and $20 of that is insurance coverage charges. Would they cut you a check just for $900 value of the rifle? .......or would they pay you $948 to cover you for the rifle and the shipping charges too? The reason I ask, is because I'm never quite sure if I should declare $900 and buy insurance for $900, or if I should declare $1,000 and buy insurance for $1,000 to cover my a*s for my cost of shipping too. (ie; I'd prefer not to have to take a $68 hit on shipping and insurance charges if I can avoid it via spending another $1.90 insurance to cover it. )
 
If they pay you at all (as Butch says) , they will pay no more than the amount you insured it for. If you want to insure it for $968 you have to insure it for that amount then they might pay $968 but you will probably have to argue to get it. They will still argue package was only worth $900.

I discussed this very point with my local postal clerk one time and was told they will only pay what you can prove item is worth even if you insure it for a higher value. My one actual experience (many years ago) was on an inexpensive package $40 that I am surprised they paid at all due to what I perceived as poor packing.
 
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Insurers

Don't pay you for the cost of insurance...that's the price of admission. Doubt they will pay for shipping as its the article that's insured, but not 100% on that point. Good luck.
 
You've answered my question that they will not refund the shipping. If you think about it, that's really an injustice to do to John Q. Public; They lose your rifle, it never gets delivered to it's destination.......... and yet they refuse to refund your cost for the shipping service that they never fullfilled???? I doubt that a court of law would ever side with them. ( but not like we would sue over $48 shipping)

As for proving item value;
I always save copies of my ads, and of the check or money order that the buyer sent me. I imagine the best way to try to make the case that a rifle that they lost was worth $900 and is the fair value, is to show them a photcopy of the $900 money order that the customer submitted and paid to you! Now, on the other hand if you were NOT selling the rifle and just shipping a rifle to a gunsmith, and theirs no paystubs to show....then you've got a harder case to prove.
 
You've answered my question that they will not refund the shipping. If you think about it, that's really an injustice to do to John Q. Public; T.

I agree it is not how it should be.
It is like when you are on the turnpike but they have construction and you could have made better time on the non-toll road. It seems to me they should not be allowed to charge you the toll but it happens regularly.
 
I am not sure on the answer to your question. However I do know if you ship it 'Registered mail' every time it exchanges hands (from one person to another) it is signed for by the person accepting it!

JimP
 
Registered Mail

I am not sure on the answer to your question. However I do know if you ship it 'Registered mail' every time it exchanges hands (from one person to another) it is signed for by the person accepting it!

JimP
To add to what Jim P just posted. I understand if REGISTERED MAIL is used the insurance is substantially cheaper.
 
At any rate, I would show photos of your rifle to the postal employee. it is my understanding getting full re-embursment for a parcel from USPS is difficult. On the other hand, it ships better than UPS and a whole lot cheaper.
 
I had a rifle destroyed in shipping. I had the rifle/action builder make out a estimate/receipt for cost of replacement. They paid the full amount (I had it insured for that amount) and reinbursed me for the shippting cost also. I don't remember if I got paid for the cost of insurance. Before the claim was settled (first they refused saying it wasn't properly packed), I had the broken rifle sent back to me. They also paid the shipping costs back to me and eventually (couple of months) sent me a letter that released the broken gun to me as they had no way to dispose of the gun. Two employees were fired, my gun was the last one they had destroyed. An investigation was already under way (as other guns had been seriously damaged) and they caught them on tape taking my gun out of the case and wacking it against a pole, popping the glued in action out of the stock and breaking the kevlar stock in half.

It took around a month and a half to settle but it all worked out in the end.

Hovis
 
I hope those people suffered more than just being fired. They broke all sorts of laws by opening the packages and destroying other peoples property.
 
Shipping is always the nerve racking part of any firearms deal!

That said, I have never had a firearm shipped to me damaged or lost; although FedEx got on the wrong truck one day. I got it the next day.

My wife had a piece of stained-glass art delivered cracked by FedEx, they paid right up on the insurance (took about 3.5 weeks).

USPS refused to pay up on a spoiled food item because it was held up due to wild fires. They claimed an act of nature wasn't their fault. They further claimed the originating USPS should not have accepted it anyway! I always thought if a business'es employee messed up, the business was still responsible for the employees actions. It's natural to think when they accept $$ to provide insurance, that seals the deal; NOT SO!

All the shippers, USPS, FedEx, UPS have issues. Between them They handle millions of packages. The odds are some will get lost, stolen or ruined. Insurance fraud is carried out on both a grand scale and on a nickel&dime level. It's little wonder they are cautious.

Of course all we care about is our one, single package or insurance claim.
 
I buy and sell gold coins on occasion. For transactions going into significant money, I always use registered & insured. Cost a few bucks more, takes a little longer but problems with registered are very rare because there is a custody chain. Anyone in charge of the package has to sign for it and is personally responsible for it until the package is signed for by the next person in the chain. Unattended packages are locked up. In addition, there are very specific packaging rules for registered that make tampering or rough handling visible.

I talked to the owner of the largest online gold and silver dealer in the country and asked how often they had problems with registered. He said once in several hundreds of thousands of deliveries.

Britannia.jpg
 
Thanks guys for the input. I have NEVER suffered a loss or damage yet, but had always wondered who ends up eating the $48 shipping. I see that it is more or less arbitrary and some careful planning and common sense goes a long way!!






If anybody out there that doesn't do much shipping but cares to know a few tips that have always worked for me for many years so that I've never had a single claim yet after dozens of boxes I've shipped from sales that I've made on GunbRoker and Ebay.....here's the tips;

1) I only ship rifles in plastic gun cases, and I cover the case with cardboard. (when you see a store throwing out boxes, make it a point to drag home and save large oversized cardboard boxes for a good source of cardboard.....and also save white scrap shipping foam boards or foam blocks). When I'm at a gunshow, I will cease the opportunity to buy any $10 used plastic guncases I see available. I try to buy guncases that are square in shape and don't have a radius shaped handle bulging out. It's easier to make an outer cardboard box for it when they are rectangular.

2) Sheeesh.....USE SOME COMMON SENSE; Don't send an exposed plastic gun case, and don't spell out anything in the address that gives a hint that it's firearms related. (for example, I would alter the mailing address "Jim Smith Arms Inc" into "Jim Smith Inc." or "Jim Smith A. Inc") You have to confide this to the carrier at the counter, but you DON'T have to advertise it all over the box! I had a gentleman who worked at FedEx recently buy a $2,000 AR15 from me. He gave me a pre-paid self addressed label to his FFL that was printed "Practical Firearms LLC" (for example). When he scanned and emailed the label to me, and I printed it up and I saw the shipping address name, I almost had a stroke! I was so upset about this, that I threatened to call off the deal. When I spoke to him over the phone about it, he had no clue he had done anything to cause concern.

3)Always print labels for legibility and double check the address twice . I'm currently waiting over a month now for a package from a clown in Tampa Fla who spelled my Street address as "Baltimore" instead of "Balmore"......and to top it off, he wrote "77009" instead of "77069". In the past my Post Office has figured out one error and made delivery, but not two errors like this. My advice is DON'T DRINK AND DRIVE, OR DON'T DRINK AND SHIP..... I'm guessing that marijuana and other drugs would probably cause the same retarded effect too!!!! LOL.

4) Cushion and wrap parts and assemblies with some kind of stuffing so they don't rub and/or scratch. It's not uncommon for me to slip an old cotton athletic sock over a muzzle, and a dry-cleaners plastic bag over the whole rifle. The butt end already has a recoil pad on it and is well cushioned. I then put foam board on both sides of the rifle so it can't ramrod through the box.....especially the muzzle end.
The only resemblence of a complaint that I've ever received was a buyer telling me that he was disapointed that I didn't send him the other sock too.

5) DON'T VERBALLY SPELL OUT THE ADDRESS TO THE OTHER PARTY over the phone if you can avoid it. Politely explain your concern and offer to email it to him instead. About 10 years ago I dictated my mailing information to a buyer over the phone. I was selling a Sako Sporter rifle for $975. The buyers check took 2 weeks to turn around and go back to him undeliverable. He wrote the wrong street and wrong zip code. In the meantime, he was stressing out that I had run off with his money.

6) With USPS, I will ONLY ship a rifle worth over $1,000 via insured and registered mail. I've never had a buyer yet turn down the purchase of a $1,900 rifle yet because of the $75 shipping charges. (ie; plastic gun case included in the charge)






Guys, trust me when I say that I've learned most of this stuff the hard way. Unfortunately, I learned most of this from the sellers and shippers who I have less control over when I'm the one on the receiving end.
 
Having to file and fight a claim or two, here are a couple pointers.

1. Always insure for the amount needed.

2. Delivery confirmation or receipt required.

3. They will automatically depreciate the amount by 50% first time around. They plan on most people taking "what they give" and dropping the claim at that point.

4. Then you must file an appeal with justification as to why it should not be depreciated from the insured amount.

5. When you file the claim be sure to include a request to be reimbursed for the shipping costs.

It has taken a letter or two, but got full amount both times.
 
Postal claims

Several years ago, I began selling my entire collection of 34 Sako rifles, some very old, on gunbroker. In one week, the USPO broke two L57's that were packed tight with newspaper in cardboard gun boxes. It took me 4 months to make settlement, but they did pay only the insured amount. They did not pay the amounts I paid the buyers to ship them back. Here are a few tips: First communication you will receive is a letter telling you that you are not licensed to ship any firearm. I sent both to FFL dealers and had to quote the BATF regs in response. 2. Read the USPO regs for shipping firearms, especially regarding packing securely. 3. Keep all receipts until transaction is complete to buyers satisfaction. The USPS will want your original receipts when you make claim. They will also want: Photos of the damaged guns and their shipping containers. Statement from the buyer regarding its condition upon arrival. An appraisal from any FFL holder. It is also a good idea to photo them in the box to show whatever material you use for tight packing. They will decline claim if not packed securely.

Prior to settlement, I was required to take both guns to a post office, and given a receipt which I sent to their St. Louis Claims Office. After settlement, they kept the rifles.
 
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