Jackie -- 30s in a LV

C

Charles E

curmudgeon
Read your post on the recoil of a .30 in a 10.5 pound rifle. You probably have read Henry River's article on 6mmbr.com on shooting .30s. While you can't argue with Henry's success, it isn't "my style." Requires too much attention to detail and coordination. Not my strengths.

I like recoil pads. I have a couple "medium chambered" 1,000 yard guns. They don't really need a brake, but the comfort level without one is a bit less than one would want. I added a recoil pad, which solved the problem.

These 1K rifles have Adamovitz-style stocks. Hard to find a pad small enough to fit. There is a Kick-Ezz Junior that can be ground to fit. The only issue is sorbathane doesn't completely recover it's shape after storage though, so if you store the rifle butt-down, over time the pad develops an ugly bulge.

I'd bet you could figure out a way to solve that one -- if so, let me know.

An unexpected benefit came with cleaning the rifle. Turned out that the edge of the aluminum butt-plate was digging into my palm. Didn't really notice it until I put the pad on. Sort of like how good you feel when you stop banging your head with a hammer.

Now I know, and you know, that for any match, you shoot whatever rifle is shooting best if you're willing to put the rounds on the barrel. 6mm, .308, whatever. What is nice about the recoil pad is if, like me, you find a 10.5 pound 30 BR a bit much, it opens up an option.

* * *

What so many people said: what was REALLY impressive with your record was the shooting, not the caliber.

In awe,

Charles
 
LV 10.5lb 30cal Shooting Techniques

I, as well as others, who are currently building LV 10.5lb 30cal rigs for registered competitions would like to here more opinions on the handling the heavier recoil of 10.5lb 30cal rifles versus the 6ppc.

I have spoken with Randy Robinett Tues morning on this very subject and he said, in regards to shooting "free recoil", to keep your shoulder away from the butt and let the let the rig run out of steam before it tags your shoulder. He also thought it would be a good idea to move the scope forward a bit in an effort to give some scope/nose clearance.:)

Does anyone have any opinions on pinning these rigs in competition?

Maybe Randy, HBR shooters and others can chime in and expound on the shooting techniques of these LV 30's in an effort to shorten up the learning curve for novices.

Thanks for your help.
 
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I've shot a 30 PPC in LV for a couple of years. I do not shoot free recoil. Got scars on my nose and one time after shooting a match in Denton my shoulder was black and blue for a few weeks. A lot of the fellows I shoot with in Tx. use shoulder pads. I don't I just pin the thing and let her buck. When you pin them make sure you do it the same every time or your shots will be all over the place. If your ever in Denton watch Mike Stinnett shoot he makes it look easy.
 
333smitty said:
I, as well as others, who are currently building LV 10.5lb 30cal rigs for registered competitions would like to here more opinions on the handling the heavier recoil of 10.5lb 30cal rifles versus the 6ppc.

I have spoken with Randy Robinett Tues morning on this very subject and he said, in regards to shooting "free recoil", to keep your shoulder away from the butt and let the let the rig run out of steam before it tags your shoulder. He also thought it would be a good idea to move the scope forward a bit in an effort to give some scope/nose clearance.:)

Does anyone have any opinions on pinning these rigs in competition?

Maybe Randy, HBR shooters and others can chime in and expound on the shooting techniques of these LV 30's in an effort to shorten up the learning curve for novices.

Thanks for your help.
Click to expand...

If I were going to build a 30 cal LV rig, I think I would put it in a McMillan Edge HUNTER stock(very stiff) and use a hunter weight barrel(stiffer than a LV contour, check out Dan Lilja's website) with a nice, thick sorbothane recoil pad. I have shot borrowed hunter guns built like this and have had no problem using a light grip on the Edge stock(very nice pistol grip for this purpose) with my shoulder just touching the nice, cushy pad. Piece of cake.
 
Shooting a light 30 is like getting jiggy with a fat chick....just something you gotta get used to.
BTW, I have had a shoulder replacement and shoot a 30X47 in Hunter class, free recoil.
 
My bat

I currently have a BAT Varmint Hunter rifle in a Kelbly Klub HBR stock. I have shot it free recoil since the first shot went through it and have no trouble with it, of course I am conditioned to it. I shot nearly the same rifle in a full 308 for a couple of years so I learned to "Love the Bomb". It isn't the most accurate rifle I have owned and think the barrel is just so-so but the 308 may have been the most accurate I have owned.

A little story; several years ago I bought a Rattler in a McMillain Edge stock. The rifle had just previously won a VFS match with a very high X count and I am thinking 23Xes. The reason I bought it was based on that performance. The rifle shot the very best all the time I owned it. I have never felt handicapped when using a 2.25" stock. The handicap will always be the barrel.
 
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"getting jiggy with a fat chick"..............now thats just nasty..!...:D
 
To all the guys that are talking about a 10lb Hunter or VH rig, you are talking apples and oranges when comparing to a 10.5 lb gun with a 3" wide forend. They just don't recoil in the same manner. The 3" forend brings the gun back sharper than the 2.25" guns. The reason is the straight back tracking of the wider forend. The thinner forends roll in the bags and the felt recoil is entirely different.

I have successfully campaigned a LV 30 in Group, shooting free recoil at times, as well as holding the gun at others. One thing I can tell you is that there is a price to be paid when shooting either style. They just pound on ya'. I've found that I can shoot free recoil with the rifle at some ranges, but not at others. Really depends on whether the targets are uphill, downhill, or level. Getting the feel of the range in practice before the match is critical with a LV 30. I've spent weekends drilling holes that I couldn't believe myself, but I've also found myself on the other end of the situation. Last weekend was a good example. At Mainville, the targets are considerably uphill, so some sort of hold, or shouldering the gun is a must. Anyhow, I spent the first yardage struggling with the light 30. Both with tune and gun handling. When I finally figured it out, I shot a decent target on match 5, but the damage had already been done. I put the gun away for the rest of the weekend. No reason to punish myself when I could shoot my HV 30 or LV PPC the rest of the way. I had a handle on the conditions and shot fairly well once I made that decision. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from going the LV 30 route, only warning everyone that it is an entirely different animal than what most are used to...
 
The first time I shot my Metal Mayhem stock on a CF it was on a 40x in 6mmBeggs that weighed about 12 lbs. I didn't figure the 6 would kick hard enough to be a problem. Hello !!! Purple and yellow shoulder.

When I started doing the 30BR MM I knew I was going to have to do something about a recoil pad. The rifle was built and a match was just a couple of days away and I hadn't found a recoil pad to my liking so I looked around the shop for a temporary pad [ I think Shelly used some bubble wrap ]. What I found was a roll of Frost King Rubber Foam Weatherseal. The stuff I had on the shelf is 3/4" wide, 7/16" thick x 10 feet long. It's black closed cell foam, PN R734.

I use one strip on the back end of the butt and can fire a full 10 target match with absolutely no bruising or soreness. The foam feels too soft to have much effect but I guess it's the rising rate effect that makes it so effective.

I also think this pad helps me control the rifle while shooting free recoil. I actually lay my shoulder LIGHTLY against the foam. I rock my shoulder back and forth so that I know when I am just barely touching it. When I touch off the shot the rifle does recoil at least 1/4" or more before the foam starts to compress enough to start slowing the rifle down. There is enough compressibility in the foam that if you lay up against it a little too firmly it still seems to let the shot hit where the others did.

At the end of the match I peel it off and throw it away.
 
My 10.5 pound 30BR has a nice dense foam recoil pad that really helps a lot. It is made from the same material that radio controle car racers, (1/4 scale), make their tires out of. My younger Brother, who used to race those, had a 1 inch thick sheet of it, I just cut out and shaped a pad, and it works great.

My problem is I cannot shoot Benchrest any way but free recoil, or at least, at this time. After a aggs worth of shooting with the LV weight Rifle, I can pretty well count on a migrain headache that night. It starts in my neck, and progresses all the way to mt fore head.

The Rifle really does not hurt at all when I shoot in, but that constant shock against my shoulder is apparently shocking my neck area, hence the headaches.

I am going to do a lot of practicing with my 10.5 pound 30 this week end. Maybe I can figure something out. I don't mean to sound like a wimp, but splitting headaches sort of take the fun out of the whole endevour. The thing really shoots great, as I have done quite well in the few yardages that I have shot with it.

I have a recoil pad as well on my HV, heck, I think it is just as easy to shoot as a 6PPC, maybe even a tad better, with that ultra slow twist barrel, .........jackie
 
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An Alternative, perhaps:

Several years ago I conversed with a fellow HBR shooter in Washington State about the new Lapua 6 mm 47 brass and HBR rifles in general. This gent had distroyed his right shoulder in a Dirt Bike accident and had thought he would not be able to continue with HBR shooting. He found a source for a recoil absorbing butt that utilizes a spring which absorbs almost all the recoil of a 30-47 HBR rifle. He was or is able to compete still, wrecked shoulder and all! I think it is a shotgun device but, hey !

One of these devices probably won't be pretty but it may very well make a 10.5lb rifle managible. Function trumps form always.
 
30BR SP/LV Recoil Solutions

Pete Wass said:
Several years ago I conversed with a fellow HBR shooter in Washington State about the new Lapua 6 mm 47 brass and HBR rifles in general. This gent had distroyed his right shoulder in a Dirt Bike accident and had thought he would not be able to continue with HBR shooting. He found a source for a recoil absorbing butt that utilizes a spring which absorbs almost all the recoil of a 30-47 HBR rifle. He was or is able to compete still, wrecked shoulder and all! I think it is a shotgun device but, hey !

One of these devices probably won't be pretty but it may very well make a 10.5lb rifle managible. Function trumps form always.
Click to expand...

Pete,

Thanks for the tip. Can you or anyone provide more information on this shotgun type recoil absorbing butt plate? I would really like to see one.

This thread has some really good info in it.

Lets keep it goin. :)

Thanks a lot Guys.......
 
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I shoot my LV 30 totally free recoil for the most part. This is totally new to me. I used to use a fair amount of thumb pressure on top of the grip area, but with an open hand, so not actually gripping the gun. This thumb pressure must be consistent. Usually I would use enough pressure to raise the crosshair from either 6 o'clock on the 9 or 10 ring to the center of the 10 ring. This method not only worked well, and it also drastically reduced the felt recoil. About a 1/2" gap between butt and shoulder was used.

The reason for the recent switch to free recoil was to allow me to shoot heads up when I felt like it would benefit me. The old 30-30 responded well to free recoil with a lot of .1's, and a recent .082" group at Raton's last match. The thing is, I have shot 30's so long now that I really am not bothered by the recoil of a LV, even though it kicks noticably more than the HV.

Michael
 
When I decided to build a 30BR I also decided to start participating in our local military bolt action club matches. Shooting a 30 cal 9.5 lb military rifle with a steel butt plate did not appeal to me. So I took the liberty of obtaining a Past shoulder fit recoil pad. I got the thick one, I think it is 1/2" thick. I believe Mike Stinnett at Denton uses one also. All I can say is they work and work well. Don't know what kind of material they are made from.

Donald
 
recoil reducing butt plates

There are a few recoil reducer type of stock butt plates out there. Some use springs - some springs and hydraulics. I’ve never seen one in real life. I’d like to know how well they work. Sure could be a case of scope face in the making.
Here’s a link to some of them:
http://speedbumpstockworks.blogspot.com/
http://graco-corp.com/gra-coil.aspx?CategoryId=18

Brownels sometimes has the Ken Rucker version in stock.

All the best,
Jeff
 
The real question is, can ya make weight with either of them in a 10.5lb gun moreso than if they work IMO.--Mike Ezell
 
The device I spoke of earlier

was lite enough so that the fellow who told me about it made weight for a 10 LB HBR rifle. He said it was hard to do but did get it done.

I noticed in a recent Benelli Ad a spring type recoil device in at least one model of their shotguns. Hey folks, this is a challenge and one that should easily be solved. The shotgun folks have been dealing with this issue for a long time. Before I shot Rifles competatively I shot Skeet a bit. I could not endure the pounding of a 12ga OU gun so I went to a Bumber Jack. Even it was more than I wanted but I know they have come a long way since then.

Perhaps the "Exotic Stocks" will suffer a bit on this one but if function trumps form, we are home free.
 
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Recoil Reduction System

mwezell said:
The real question is, can ya make weight with either of them in a 10.5lb gun moreso than if they work IMO.--Mike Ezell
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Good point Mike. In an effort to make weight I could forgo the tuner for a RRS but I dont wanna do that. Maybe the 1/2" shoulder pad in combination with adding 7/16" adhesive foam to the butt plate is the short term answer. I'll also have to "man up" and deal with the recoil. I have shot Jackies 10.5lb 30BR sporter and it definetly gets your attention.

Any other RRS ideas without adding weight to the rifle?
 
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Pete Wass said:
was lite enough so that the fellow who told me about it made weight for a 10 LB HBR rifle. He said it was hard to do but did get it done.

I noticed in a recent Benelli Ad a spring type recoil device in at least one model of their shotguns. Hey folks, this is a challenge and one that should easily be solved. The shotgun folks have been dealing with this issue for a long time. Before I shot Rifles competatively I shot Skeet a bit. I could not endure the pounding of a 12ga OU gun so I went to a Bumber Jack. Even it was more than I wanted but I know they have come a long way since then.

Perhaps the "Exotic Stocks" will suffer a bit on this one but if function trumps form, we are home free.
Click to expand...

I've put some on shotguns and don't recall the weight but Danuser(IIRC) makes one that is listed as being 12oz! I don't doubt your friend but I don't know where he could have found that much "fat" on a HBR gun.

333, I'd prefer the tuner myself, but my shoulders are still pretty good, though not nearly as good as 20 years ago.---Mike Ezell
 
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