barrel cleaning

S

squirrelduster

Guest
I have a question regarding barrel cleaning.
I shot a group of .242 last week with my 300 win mag, took it home and cleaned it with two wet patches of ahooters choice followed by a wet brush run through about 15 or so passes. I let it set for a few hours then ran two more wet patches followed by two dry.
My groups today started off around an inch and a half.
It settled down after about 15 to around a half inch.
What causes this?
Should I not clean the barrel until I shoot 30 or so rounds?
Thanks for the help.
Steve
 
assuming something

I am going to assume this ia a factory barrel. If that is true then here is my experence:

I had a Remington 7 Mag that shot 175 Patitions really really good.

One rainy day I decided to clean the hell out of that barrel.

Next trip to the range, I got really ill. The groups opened way up.

So I shot it and cleaned it as normal and after a while the barrel seasoned up like an old cast iron frying pan and began shooting really really good again.

I don't shoot many factory barrels any more, but I do pay attention to what cleaning procedure makes my big game rifles shoot, in group, clean and cold.

Yea, I do, do things extra special after cleaning, which includes a product called Lock-Ease.
 
Some barrels are like that. As the barrels wear in and become easier to clean, they don't take as much seasoning before they tighten back down. I think it has something to do with the carbon and copper slicking the barrel back up.
You might try giving your barrel a really good scouring with JB Paste (not Bore Brite). I give a new factory barrel 500 (that's right) passes with a tight patch of JB Paste. Use a tight fitting bore guide and follow directions. It works for me. The grit in the JB Paste is much finer than the finest grit to lap a barrel so you don't have to worry about enlarging the bore or moving the throat. I'm told, but don't know, that JB Paste is made from wheat and the grit is the naturally occuring silica sand in the wheat.
 
same thing here on Savage 10fp

The exact same behavior can be repeated on my Savage 10FP in 308. It has done this the last 5 cleanings. Will shoot .5 inch groups with ease at 100yds and then after a cleaning go to 4-5 inch groups. After about 30-40 rounds it settles back down to 1 inch or less. Takes about 50 rounds to get below .5 inches. My best group ever so far has been .4 inches at 150yds. That was after 80 shots. I don't get it but I'm glad I'm not the only one that has the same symptoms.

Mike
 
It should only take 2 or 3 rounds to foul the barrel.
I think the problem was you. It just took you awhile to get some wind conditions that let the bullets go into the group.
Ted
 
Probably the shooter, not the gun......

It is very rare to see a gun shoot wild, then settle down. I have personally never had a rifle that has done this and Have owned a lot of Rem's, Rugers, and customs.
 
I don't know what kind of rifle you're shooting nor how many rounds you're calling a group but if it is a factory rifle and it's shooting .25" groups you need to have it bronzed and put over your mantle. Same deal if it's shooting .5" groups. I'm not being a smart ass but if it's a factory rifle and you are CONSISTANTLY getting those results then you've had quite a bit of shop work done on it and your bench technique is right up there with the best.

IMO, if you are getting real world CONSISTANT 1-1.25" 5 shot groups at 100 yards from a factory rifle, especially with store bought ammo, you've got a damn fine rifle regardless of what you read in cyberspace.

I kinda agree that is shouldn't take very many rounds to "season" the barrel. And it shouldn't take too many to get you dialed back in behind the rifle.
 
Thank you all for your responses.
This is not a factory barrel it is a Hart installed by R.W. Hart.
The groups are consistently around a half inch if you use the On Target group calculator.
I have a lot of time invested in the development of the loads. Lots of group work with changing the seating depth and different powder charges.
John S is right on the money from what I have been able to figure out.
If the barrel is too clean it won't shoot.
I have talked to the people at Hart that have been involved with the Olympic shooting team and what they are saying is that the cleaning really makes a difference. They experimented with different oils after cleaning and determined that if you don't use oil after cleaning it actually makes the barrel sticky and it takes several shots, up to 9 or 10, to foul the barrel enough to make it shoot. The brand of oil also makes a difference. Some oil it only takes a couple of shots some it takes up to 5 or 6 shots. This is what I was told from Hart from their talking with the shooting team.
I would believe that the reason we don't hear more about this is that the people that shoot serious bench rest know what they are doing and have experimented enough to know what works for them. The rest of us that are just casual shooters or hunters don't have rifles capable of shooting great groups so would not notice if the group opens from 1 1/4 inches to 1 1/2 inches.
I have learned a lot since I have started the load development for the new Hart barrel.
I have had several suggestions that the wind has played a part in my groups but is sure seems that the wind would play a minor role.
 

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A factory rifle that shoots a sub quarter MOA group is unusual, and so is one that shoots half MOA. If your rifle shoots half MOA, and is a hunting rifle, there's nothing you'll shoot at that you'll miss because the rifle isn't accurate enough - even if you're shooting prairie dogs. :eek:

Rifles don't shoot the same sized group time after time either, except for the very best BR rifles fired by the very best shooters. I've seen some pretty well turned out BR rifles that were having an off day where a half MOA group would have been nearly a cause for celebration. Or the shooter was having a bad day.
 
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Larry Elliott said:
:eek:

Rifles don't shoot the same sized group time after time either, except for the very best BR rifles fired by the very best shooters. I've seen some pretty well turned out BR rifles that were having an off day where a half MOA group would have been nearly a cause for celebration. Or the shooter was having a bad day.
Click to expand...


Mr. Larry Elliott can you possibly find out which of the two is it?

Mr. Larry Elliott could you believe in the possibility, that the shooter may have been already celebrating.

Con
 
Mr Cross,
Would it be possible for me to have half.


Regards Chris.
 
I recently finished break-in with my 300WM Krieger and 204 Lilja. I too have shot some groups in the 3's and decided not to clean until the rifle tells me it's time. I did clean a few times during load developement and I can't explain why you barrel needs so many rounds to settle down. Each my my barrels require one fouler and they normally print next to the group. Good luck.
 
There was a big go around in another forum about shooting a dry barrel or a oily barrel after cleaning and one fellow opined that if you take a piece of brass stock and strike it against a piece of dry steel stock it would leave much more brass behind than if you struck it against a piece of oiled steel stock. So, since then, I put a patch wet with Kroil thru the barrel and follow it with two dry patches which should leave a light film of oil.

FWIW, I've noticed at some of the matches, the Bench shooters are not as rightous about cleaning after each relay as they were in years past.
 
Now I know that I'm a noob here, but I noticed the same thing. I am trying a new cleaning process. I was shooting good groups during load developement and then I loaded my final rounds, 300 win mag, 180 grain nosler accubond, federal lr primers with 74.5 grains of reloader 22. I could not hit my donkey and was about to give up, when after 12 rounds it started grouping again. .365 on the final group. Now the gun is shooting better than me.
 
Chris. T-

Is the half you have half full or half empty? If it was a half pint , well, that wasn't enough anyway. BARKEEP--another round, please! Steve
 
Stephen B,mate I would like half of what Mr cross is on,reckon that would do me.:rolleyes::rolleyes:.

Regards Chris.
 
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