Barnes Lead Free?

R

Ramsh00ter

Guest
Anyone got any input on the Barnes Lead Free stuff.

I live in the Peoples Republic of California, so I am faced with this new regulation for bullets that are lead free.

Looking for input on loading experiences as to which direction the loads tend to be, i.e. same weight bullet takes less or more powder to equal same performance.

Not looking for specific loads, just experiences.

I will be loading for 3 different calipers, 270, 30/06, and 338.

Thanks in advance,

Randy
 
Being from California,I had to go lead free to hunt my local zones.I hunt with a 25-06 and 308.With these two rifles using the same load but subtituting the Barnes Triple Shock bullet I noticed an increase in velocity.I reduced the load a grain or so to compensate for the increase and all turned out well.Accuraccy was superb in both cases.
 
Ray,

Thank you very much, that is exactly what I was looking for.

I have a couple of pet loads for my 270's and a short time to develope loads.

That gives me a direction to head. I will prob start about 2 grains light and work up. The normal loads I shoot are very mild, so I should be pretty safe starting there.

Thanks again,

Randy
 
If you want to shoot the Varmint Grenades or MPG green bullets, you should know that the heavier weights may require a faster twist to stabilize. The 62 grain 6mm VG is as long as a 95-100 grain lead core bullet and requires at least a 1:10 twist. Same with the 50 grain .224 VG it needs at least 1:10. The 55 grain .224 MPG needs a 1:9 twist. I had to rebarrel one rifle to use them, and my 6mm PPC-USA Sako A-1 Varminter can't use the Varmint Grenade due to a 1:14 twist. Good thing regular lead bullets can be used outside of the Condor range, but it's a drive for me.
 
On Copper Bullets.

Yesterday I tried some 62g Barnes in my 220 Swift. Had this theory that if they were driven hard enough they might stabalise,but it did'nt work. Could just get them all on an A4 sheet of paper at 100yds and thats all. Barnes Varmint Grenades shoot well in the swift but go through the target side ways out of my 1 in 14 twist 22hornet. Can't see that a bit of lead in the country side would do any harm, maybe there is an agenda?:mad:
 
Murphy,

I shoot a Swift improved with a 14 twist Hart, I have never gotten anything over a 53 grain bullet to shoot, just can't spin them fast enough. 50 & 52 grain bullets make little clusters.

Attached is a spreadsheet I put together to look at bullet RPM in relation to velocity and barrel twist. You can change the barrel twists to anything you want and by changing the velocity, you can see just how fast you are spinning the bullet.

Most people are surprised by just how fast we spin these bullet, I sure was!

Let's say the ideal velocity for a long bullets is around 3100-3200 fps from an 7.5-8 twist barrel to stabilise it. According to the spread sheet, this equals about 300,000 RPM. If you change the velocity in the spread sheet to approx 5900-6000 FPS, you can reach the 300,000 RPM number.

Obviously, we can never reach velocities anywhere near that. Long sleek bullets from slow twist barrels just don't work.


Regarding the lead bullet ban in California, that is exactly what it is, an agenda.

Back in the 70's while working in the gun store, I made the statement many times (and I still stand by it) "They will never get out guns, but they will chock us with regulations to the point that most shooters will give up!" That is exactly what is happening her in California.

In the 70's there was prob 40-50 good gun stores, I can now count them all on one hand with fingers left over. We had a shop in the valley called "The Reloading Center", carried no guns, no loaded ammo, nothing but reloading supplies. The City of LA made it so hard on him with red tape and just plain harrassment, he gave up. Closed the shop and moved to Arizona.

It was so bad, they were sending in underage guys in trying to buy powder and primers. Cliff caught them twice getting into police cars behind the shop after being turned down. I don't know what you call it, I call it HARASSMENT!

We ended up loosing a very very good shop. :(:(

Randy
 

Attachments

  • Bullet%20RPM(1).xls
    16.5 KB · Views: 189
Lynn,

I had the same experience years ago with Barnes 140 grain 270's. I couldn't get below 2", so I called them.

The first thing they asked was how close to the lands are you seating the bullets. When I told them about .005" back.

They told me no closer then .040, .050" is better.

I said "your kidding right!" Nope, dead serious.

They then explained the reason and if you think about it, it makes since.

Barnes jackets are very very tough, if you seat too close to the lands, the bullet starts moving and then is stopped for a moment, which causes the preasure to spike.

By seating the bullet deaper, the bullet gets a running start and the preasure curve is much smoother.

So I tried it, my 270 No 1 went back to shooting like is is supposed to.

So, my intentions with the triple shock is to start at .050" back from the lands.

Thanks for your input and sharing your experiences with everyone. Barnes are great bullets, but you have to think outside the box or you will be disappointed.

Randy
 
located?

axlenut said:
If you want to shoot the Varmint Grenades or MPG green bullets, you should know that the heavier weights may require a faster twist to stabilize. The 62 grain 6mm VG is as long as a 95-100 grain lead core bullet and requires at least a 1:10 twist. Same with the 50 grain .224 VG it needs at least 1:10. The 55 grain .224 MPG needs a 1:9 twist. I had to rebarrel one rifle to use them, and my 6mm PPC-USA Sako A-1 Varminter can't use the Varmint Grenade due to a 1:14 twist. Good thing regular lead bullets can be used outside of the Condor range, but it's a drive for me.
Click to expand...

Do you live in California, If so, what town are you in?.
Roland
 
I live on the S.F. Peninsula, and have been hunting ground squirrels in Las Padres N.F. west of King City since 1967.
 
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