8208 brx, not there yet

jackie schmidt

jackie schmidt

New member
We finally had a day that got up to 80 degrees. A beautiful one at that. So, we finally got to see what the new BRX Powder would do in warmer weather.

The very same load that shot quite well in my Sporter last week end at 55 degrees, (31.9 grns), shot terrible today. .350 verticle, very wind sensitive, ugly. The tuner helped a little, but not much.

I started going down, and at 31.1, it started acting like a Benchrest Rifle. I got it down to about a bullet hole of verticle, then got it into the ones with the tuner. This powder charge was yeilding an average 3330 fps out of the 21 1/2 inch Krieger.

I then put my Rail Gun on the bench, and shot some 5 shot groups with the same laod as I used in the Sporter. The velocity jumped to an average 3380 due to the 2 inch longer barrel. The first group was a 4 shot "zero" with the fifth shot hanging down to about a .180. I then caught a nice gentle cross wind and nailed a "zero".

I was pleased enough to now try a 10 shot group. I stacked 9 in about a .180, but the 6th shot popped down for what ever reason, to at least a .250. I then stacked 3 more dead in the middle of the originol nine. Those 13 shots measured no bigger than a .180, but that one hanging down killed it. I tried another, and it sort of did the same thing, only this time two shots went out.

It was getting late, so I decided to load up a block with my favorite load of 133, 30.4 grns. I nailed a nice round 10 shot group, dead in the center of the mothball, with white showing all around. That's darned small. The velocity was an average 3470 for the 10 shots.

I don't feel anywhere near comfortable enough with this new powder to shoot it in a Match as of yet. It seems to be quite temperature sensitive as far as agging capability goes.

Gary Walters went all the way down to 30.1 in his Rail Gun, and shot some really nice 5 shot groups. Maybe that is where we need to go in the warmer weather.

Obviously more testing is needed. If we had a match in the morning, I would not have a clue as to what load to go to the line with........jackie
 
Jackie

I went down to 31.0/31.1. Hope to try the same load early one morning this week. Is all the hype true? I have my doubts, but we will see. This powder will shoot. I left the range happy. I am going to try it at our first match. It won't be first time I have tried something new and shot like a ninny.

GW
 
Jackie
According to the Hodgdon video this stuff works from 30 belowe to 160 degrees in the desert.
Waterboy
 
Fyi

It was getting late, so I decided to load up a block with my favorite load of 133, 30.4 grns. I nailed a nice round 10 shot group, dead in the center of the mothball, with white showing all around. That's darned small. The velocity was an average 3470 for the 10 shots.


Jackies 10 shot n-133 30.4gr group measured .171

Hang on to your 133!!! :)
 
Everything is bigger in Texas, including the powder charges!:D Try 30.6 grains when it gets above 70 degrees. I know I know, it will only spit bullets at 3250 or so but if it shoots bugholes, who cares?
 
I had a disapointing day

I went to a fairly big gun show today in Lakeland Florida and could not find one lousy pound of the Golden Fleese! I was bummed. I wanted to try it in my short 30-284 :(
 
Goodgrouper

You may be right. And I agree. I don't care how fast it goes as long as it aggs.

For over four years, I shot a specific lot of 133 and never changed the load more than a couple of tenths one way or another. I hope I can find a combination with the BRX that will do the same.

But to do that, I think we may have to forget every thing we learned about tuning with 133, and find out a new system to go with this powder........jackie
 
Jackie, if I remember correctly your sizing die is pretty aggressive in neck area to accomodate 133. Try a die with a little less neck tension.
 
John

Some time back, possibly 3 years ago, I stopped using so much neck tension. I found that it contributed to runnout in the loaded round. I modified my die to where it gives about .0015. The 133 seemed to shoot just as well.

The bottom line is that the BRX is rather slow, that is, when compared to 133. Since it is denser, we have no problem getting 32 grns in the case if you so desired. Ever shot this stuff at sundown. There is quite a big ball of fire compared to a regular load of 133.

My big concern is how bad the Rifle went to shooting when the temperature went from 55 to 80 degrees. I consider having to drop the charge a full grain a big move. On match day, it is not uncommon to have that big of a swing from the early morning to the afternoon.

I suspect that with the Sporter length barrel, we are not really making use of the burn rate.

I am sure Hogdon had something in mind when they chose this specific burn rate. They surely know how this game is played.

I talked to a good friend who was at The Cactus, and he stated that a lot of shooters were testing the new powder the days prior to the Match, but not very many used it. Maybe the confidense is just not there as of yet. The big exception was Larry Sharnhorst, who did quite well. It would be interesting to see how he did it.......jackie
 
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jackie schmidt said:
I talked to a good friend who was at The Cactus, and he stated that a lot of shooters were testing the new powder the days prior to the Match, but not very many used it. Maybe the confidense is just not there as of yet. The big exception was Larry Sharnhorst, who did quite well. It would be interesting to see how he did it.......jackie
Click to expand...

I shot on the bench next to Larry's bench although I was the following relay and I was under the impression he was using the old 8208? Why I thought this is because he was asking my bench partner (who was on Larry's relay) how he liked the new powder after discovering he had been using it. Then at one point, both their guns needed tuning during the match so my partner went up three clicks on the measure and Larry made an adjustment to his tuner that he said was equivalent to going up .3 of powder. I never heard him say anything about XBR but maybe he was using it? I know he had been using Benchmark quite a bit last year..........
 
I know I haven't tested as much of the new 8208 as most but I got my best consistancy and wind bucking between 3250 and 3300 fps. I could get a good group going above 3400fps but it had the tendancy to pop a shot and when looking at the target, that one shot was not clean and small. I did my testing at 200 yds. My old 8208, I could go 1/2 click in either direction and not ruin a group. That was with three different lot numbers. However, with the new stuff, the groups stayed round but went from .2xx & .3xx to a inch or bigger. I can post some more accurate data later if anyone is interested.

One thing I did notice. The first couple of groups I tried with the new 8208, I forgot to clean the old out. Bullet looked like they were ready to keyhole until I cleaned. I know that shooting over a different residue isn't good but this was really different and strange.

Hovis
 
Sounds like Benchmark. Shoots good below 70 deg. and goes to hell above 80 deg. throwing shots. I have been shooting Benchmark for 9 years and it never fails to throw shots in hot weather. I use V when the temp. climbs. Maybe my buddy was right when he said the 8208xbr was nothing more than a slow lot of Benchmark.
 
Kevin

Maybe that is why Gary Walters was getting really good groups last week at just 30.2 grns. I figure that is about 3250 fps.

I guess at the next session, we should go down there and see what happens.........jackie
 
Let's us know Jackie. I'll post some of my data later when I get home. Oh, by the way...did I tell you I found out how '07 V133 works...now I know how some are making it work. Watched a friend work i over who said he had been shooting real well with it but hadn't shot any over a chrono yet. Let's just say everyone was right when they said "It don't act like V133".

Hovis
 
8208xbr shooting

I got to try a little the last couple weeks..

The first good groups came with 31.5 grains just like the Carmichael article in the Hodgdon 2010 annual Reloading manual magazine stated. (He won HV at IBS nationals last yr with this load he said)

long story short a couple days later it was quite a bit cooler, & to get the same group I had to go up 8/10 of a grain for the little groups to show up again. This is about as far as i can go without starting to compress the load.
still no pressure signs to speak of though..

Maybe a longer barrel than my 22 inch tube could help?

This is just 2 days of testing so take this with a grain of salt for sure.. (I'm in east Tn. temp probably 60+ on first day and 45-50 on 2nd day)

Kirk
 
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'07 v133

Jackie,

I saw Hovis' comment to you regarding '07 V133 and that he knows someone who knows how to make it shoot. Is the answer a secret or is it relatively well known? I know that you sold your '07. I have some too. Any info you could get would really be helpful.

Dennis Tinkham
 
Tink,

I watched the guy put group after group down range at 200yds that probably would have agg .25xx in very tough conditions. He cleaned every three groups. He then cleaned again and shot a 10 shot string over the chrono. The group looked to be in the .5xx or .6xx range, which is very good. I looked at his chrono number and then his harrels setting and couldn't believe what he was shooting........ 3180 fps. The ES was 5 fps. Now, normally V133 shoots very dirty around that velocity and causes ES to be in the 75-100 fps. So I pulled his bolt and looked down the bore. It really looked like it hadn't been shot except for the gray lingering smoke. So when I got home, I called a top shooter that had been doing quite a bit of winning with it, and confirmed that was close to the velocity he had been shooting it. He said he didn't want to mention it because everyone would tell him he's crazy.

Hovis
 
'07 v133

Hovis,

Thanks a lot. Very interesting. I don't think I have shot any V133 less than 3300 fps since I started using it ten years ago. It will be interesting to see if I can duplicate the same results. Consistant repeatability of a given load to hold a tune is what is missing from this lot. As they say before a match, "tuned on Friday, gone on Saturday morning at the first match".

Tink
 
Friday Guns

tink said:
Hovis,

Thanks a lot. Very interesting. I don't think I have shot any V133 less than 3300 fps since I started using it ten years ago. It will be interesting to see if I can duplicate the same results. Consistant repeatability of a given load to hold a tune is what is missing from this lot. As they say before a match, "tuned on Friday, gone on Saturday morning at the first match".

Tink
Click to expand...

Everybody has one.

Later
Dave
 
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