6mm PPC Rebuild

J

JEC

Guest
I am thinking of putting together a 6mm PPC sporter and would like some input regarding potentially good donor (factory) actions. I am not sure what boltface size needs to be used as the PPC cartridge has a .445 diameter rim?
 
No Brainer

JEC, in my opinion, the only true factory action I would use for a 6PPC would be a Remington 700 style, which includes the 600, 660, Model 7, 721, and 40x.

Most shooters who use one report that the factory extractor, (.473 bolt face) does a good job of catching the rim of the PPC case, so you don't have to worry about that aspect. And while most Remingtons leave a lot to be desired in the "truly straight" department, they lend themselves readilly to truing up of the criticle areas.

It is no accident that the vast majority of Benchrest Rifles were based on Remington 700 style Actions before the proliferation of so many fine custom actions.

There is an entire industry built around what you are proposing. Most Gunsmiths know the ins and outs of working with the Remington for accuracy work.

My second choice would be a savage, but that is an entirly new subject........jackie
 
If I'd only known...

Someone will likely tell you that a Rem 700 with a .223 bolt face can be opened up to PPC.

I've had two of these done, opening .223 bolts up to PPC and installing a Sako-type extractor. With the 22 PPC, I've never had any problems, but I have a short 20 PPC that has blown some cases and destroyed a couple extractors because the integrity of the bolt is reduced when the slot is milled for the extractor. (I'm sure it had nothing to do with my loads ;):D)

Today, I'd go with Jackie's suggestion, but I wasn't aware that the .473 extractor would catch the PPC groove when I had those guns built.

If you find a good buy on a donor rifle with the wrong bolt face you might try
http://www.pacifictoolandgauge.com/products/parts/remington.htm#bolts - I think Dave Kiff will provides a pretty good selection of 700 bolt options at a fair price.
 
One more comment

Since I'm not a gunsmith, there are a lot of folks more qualified to expound on this subject...just my experience.

RE: 700 actions for Lapua .220 russian brass.

The web on Lapua .220 Russian cases is not very thick - I'm sure someone here has a spec, I just have my samples...

A remington bolt face is may be counterbored to around 0.150". If the gunsmith faces the bolt, it may actually end up a couple thousands deeper.

There is a small and probably necessary gap between the bolt face and the end of the barrel tenon, and the inside edges of the chamber are generally chamfered for easier chambering. If the gap between the bolt and the tenon, plus the chamfer, plus the counterbore is greater than the web thickness of the lapua brass, (not hard to do), then the ignition pressure will be contained (or not) by the thin walls of the unsupported portion of the case just ahead of the web.

In this situation, you may find that your brass gets a ridge, much like a miniture belted mag, just in front of the web of your cases where the thin walls of the brass are unsupported. If you're shooting intense loads, and you've done things like having the firing pin bushed where you're not picking up on normal pressure signs, the brass will rupture along this ridge and blow out (In my situation, through the slot milled for the sako extractor). The ejecta will bloody your nose, forehead and cheek - safety glasses are advised for this activity.:eek:

There are a lot of remingtons out there rechambered to PPC that work just fine. There are a lot of great gunsmiths out there who do rebarreling work that is absolutely great. And you may never push a 6 PPC to pressure limits where this will be a problem...

As for me, I'd seek some more advice from some of the gunsmith on this forum who understand the mechanical differences between re-barreling for a 30-06 and .220 Russian.

JM$0.02...
 
Re-reading my last post, I'd like to clarify... my last comment could be inflamatory... I was in no way dissing the gunsmiths who build those beautiful hunting rifles I love. Political Correctness....Today's election day afterall...

If someone like Mickey Coleman, Jackie Schmidt, Billy Stevens, Gary O'cock or any number of gunsmiths or shooting machinists you see "respected" on this forum that regularly chamber the round, build your rifle, I wouldn't be too concerned. If you ask your buddy with a machine shop or the gunsmith at the local shop who builds great hunting rifles, make sure of the bolt counterbore... I'm may be redundant with this, but I came close to getting hurt because of it.
 
Is the only issue with the .473 boltface... the ability of the extractor to catch the rim, or will the larger diameter also alow some "movement" that would contribute to inaccuracy?
 
What Jeff Said

There are no safety hazzards at all when using a 6PPC based on the 220 Russian if you follow one "cardinal rule".

The 220 Russian Case, (and also the 6BR case), do not have a lot of metal from where the forward portion of the extractor groove ends to where the solid web ends. This means you have to be very carefull and keep the bolt nose to barrel clearance at a dead minimum. Get the counterbore too deep, and you can uncover the solid web of the case. This is not a good thing.

Just be careful.

Aside from that, there are thousands of Remington 700 style actions chambered in 6PPC. More than a few use the standard Remington Extractor.......jackie
 
Sorry to be chiming in so late on this topic...

Jackie - you mentioned a "dead minimum" clearance between the bolt and the barrel. I was taught "010" clearance is the way to go, but this was for general purpose rifles. Are you saying you go less than this? Are folks truing the bolt nose in order to go to near zero clearance?

Regards,
Scott
 
Several years ago Brownell's clearanced their stock of Sako 75 actions and I picked up one in PPC bolt face. I built myself a 22 PPC varmint rifle that really works well. You might be able to find one of those action and save all the worries about bolt faces and extractors. The shortcoming is the trigger. The best I could get safely was 10 oz by re-springing and polishing and I'm unaware of any match type triggers available for the Sako. Sako did have a set trigger, but I'm not sure it would be a big improvement. Most set triggers have some sort of intermediate action that slows lock time and can add unwanted vibration to the pre-ignition process.
 
why are you set on a ppc? why not go with a BR and avoid all these problems? If I was doing this project I'd get a kiff bolt with a PPC face on it and have an actual BR gunsmith fit it.
 
I am currently doing a Rem 6PPC...

I used the Rem 700 SA, and I bought a brand new bolt from Dave Kiff at Pacific Tool that is custom made with a 6PPC boltface and sako extractor. My gunsmith is about to chamber 3 each 6PPC barrels within the next 2 weeks, so I cannot give you a final report. I will use this for varmint matches in New Braunfels, Texas. I will also use it for live varmint shooting and coyote hunting. I just like the small case 6PPC and 6BR, and I enjoy shooting tiny groups. I will have my 22 & 6BR's, and I will have my first Rem 6PPC. I would go with the Rem 700 SA because after market parts are everywhere, and they lend themselves easily to a project like a Rem 6PPC. Thanks...colonel redfeather.
 
The 6PPC reamer...

I also bought my 6PPC reamer from Dave Kiff, and it came in bigger in the throat .276 than I desired(not Kiff's fault). I sent it back to have Dave regrind it to .269 in the throat because I only need to do one clean up pass if neck turning is needed, and I am trying to wring all the accuracy I can out of my Rem 700 SA 6PPC. Jackie Schmidt can chime in here because I believe he shoots some .269 throats?? We owe alot to Jackie for his shooting, testing, and experimenting with the 6BR and 6PPC, and various other case lengths and throat diameters, etc. Jackie is The General in short cased 6MM related matters. Thanks...colonel redfeather.
 
Jec

JEC said:
I am thinking of putting together a 6mm PPC sporter and would like some input regarding potentially good donor (factory) actions. I am not sure what boltface size needs to be used as the PPC cartridge has a .445 diameter rim?
Click to expand...

Jackie is absolutely correct, no problem with the PPC in a 700 action.

I built a 40X (small bolt configuration) years ago, still have it. I had the smith install a sako extractor, no problems and I have shot some hot loads in it.

But I have a observation and question. You never really indicated the use for the rifle other than sporter. Is this rifle going be for field use?

If so, minimal advantage (none in a fileld gun) are far out weighed by the trouble in forming cases. The only reason I keep my 40X as a PPC is because of the virtually unlimited supply of brass left over from my BR rigs, otherwise it would have been converted to a 6BR ages ago.

For a field gun (small game or deer) you will never be able to utilise the potiential of a PPC.

Actually, if I was doing a sporter today in 6mm, it would prob be a Dasher or a 6X47 Lapua. Nothing to do but run the case into a sizing die, fire it and you are ready to go.

JMHO

Randy
 
After more reading / research / and feedback ....I am now looking at doing a 6BR (sporter) rebuild instead of the 6PPC. Although I am still looking at the 700action, I may just use one of the TC Icon actions that I have. I have done rebuilds on two (308) Icon actions (260 Rem and 6.5 X 47 Lapua). Neither action was trued and they both shoot close to 1/2" at 100M (110yds). Anybody out there with experiece with the Icon action?
As a novice, it seems to have a lot of good features including an aluminum bedding block, 3 lug bolt, integral scope rails.
 
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