22lr by lot number

W

wiggytelsta

Member
A few weeks ago I was talking with a well known supplier of 22lr match ammo, and I asked approximately how many boxes/cases were in a "Lot". The answer, for Ely, was that ANY change would start a new lot. This included any change of components, but also when the machine operator changed! Now I would think that a company with Ely's reputation is using the best operators on the machines making their best ammo, so to change lots because operator "A" took over for operator "B" doesn't make sense. I may not have shot enough with an accurate enough rifle to see the difference, but I wonder if some of the mystique of lot numbers is just that! This isn't really a question, just wondering what others think.
 
wiggytelsta said:
A few weeks ago I was talking with a well known supplier of 22lr match ammo, and I asked approximately how many boxes/cases were in a "Lot". The answer, for Ely, was that ANY change would start a new lot. This included any change of components, but also when the machine operator changed! Now I would think that a company with Ely's reputation is using the best operators on the machines making their best ammo, so to change lots because operator "A" took over for operator "B" doesn't make sense. I may not have shot enough with an accurate enough rifle to see the difference, but I wonder if some of the mystique of lot numbers is just that! This isn't really a question, just wondering what others think.
Click to expand...

Why doesn't this make sense? You nor I probably have an appreciation for what the operators do, nor do we know how long a shift results in one lot. You seem to believe different lots represent major changes and sometimes close lots are essentially the same. I see no downside. I'd rather have a different lot than someone's assumption nothing changed.
 
Production machine operators tend to "tune" the machines to their liking (faster/slower etc.). It makes sense to me to change lot #'s.
 
No mystique about it. Different lots quite often perform differently. We don't select our ammo by lot number because we're numerologists.
 
Consecutive lots off the same machine can shoot and measure night and day differences. How that happens I do not understand. Maybe Eley does not control the machine settings very well and lets different operators tune them. That may explain things.
 
There's also apparently a fair variance in slug lenght and crimp position. Anybody, for instance, ever measure OAL of fired cases as a component of these fair sized swings in rim to ogive measurements?
 
22 cases

I've measured and weighed rounds before firing and after.....spent cases will
vary almost as much as live rounds. So far if a lot shoots good buy as much as you can afford and shoot it.
Just my thoughts.
 
It all depends on which hand is holding the chicken foot when they start the line up. Was the line rubbed cw or ccw with the foot? That can make a huge difference. On a more serious note. I have several lots of the now departed Team that shoot as well as my best lots of Tenex.
 
tim said:
You know this how, may I ask?
Click to expand...
33 years of working/operating and observing other production machine operators. Eley different ? I can't say, just an observation/experience of production machine operators I've seen in my lifetime.
 
Where is Deming and his red balls when you need him? I suspect Eley has never heard of the Seven Basic Tools of Quality.
 
Roger T said:
33 years of working/operating and observing other production machine operators. Eley different ? I can't say, just an observation/experience of production machine operators I've seen in my lifetime.
Click to expand...

So in other words " a guess".
 
If Eley is using "Statistical Process Control", changing lots numbers would allow them to track variables that were introduced into the process,
as well as track the complete manufacturing process.

Such as, shift change, vendor supplied product change, operator change, maintenance on equipment.

If SPC is used the operator can make changes to run at the upper control limit or the lower control limit and still be within the control spec's.
All of which is documented, so if there is a problem with the product, the process can be back tracked and see how it was manufactured.

It all depends on the level of detail the company wants.

FWIW - Pmoore
 
Flat Land said:
If Eley is using "Statistical Process Control", changing lots numbers would allow them to track variables that were introduced into the process,
as well as track the complete manufacturing process.

Such as, shift change, vendor supplied product change, operator change, maintenance on equipment.

If SPC is used the operator can make changes to run at the upper control limit or the lower control limit and still be within the control spec's.
All of which is documented, so if there is a problem with the product, the process can be back tracked and see how it was manufactured.

It all depends on the level of detail the company wants.

FWIW - Pmoore
Click to expand...
100%
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top